Guess it also would depend on how good the bottom end was balanced as to how much or how bad the harmonics were in the bottom end
Gorilla Girdle
- Thread starter durallymax
- Start date
That certainly has an effect.
It's another reason I keep up on the latest CNC machines and manufacturing technology.
Our crank balancer is state of the art and 6 months old.
I have always liked you guys but lately you seem to be on the mine is bigger and better than every one else bit ?? I dont care what you use to balance you ARE going to be walking mains at 1200+ hp with out reinforcements , my block is filled , rotating assembly fully balanced , main studded, girdled, and still wonder if it will be enough
although last year with hardly anything done , stock bolts , ect I didn't see near the cap walk others have.
I don't think even a perfect bottom end would prevent walk at the big horsepower levels...
I think that is why about every Prostock tractor or Super Stock tractor or Mod Diesel truck runs some sort of a girdle or bed plate...
In the drag racing I don't think they see the "load" a sled pulling engine sees, but I know you drag races wanna push to that 1500hp+ range, and you are going to need all the support and strength you can get also...
I think that is why about every Prostock tractor or Super Stock tractor or Mod Diesel truck runs some sort of a girdle or bed plate...
In the drag racing I don't think they see the "load" a sled pulling engine sees, but I know you drag races wanna push to that 1500hp+ range, and you are going to need all the support and strength you can get also...
I have always liked you guys but lately you seem to be on the mine is bigger and better than every one else bit ?? I dont care what you use to balance you ARE going to be walking mains at 1200+ hp with out reinforcements , my block is filled , rotating assembly fully balanced , main studded, girdled, and still wonder if it will be enough
Not sure where you think I am coming off that way. Simply stated that many of the guys in this thread used to trash people for girdling there bottom end now there all for it. That's it! I rarely ever get on the forums bc of all the bs that is found anymore and who rides whose coat tails etc. Not directing it in any way or form towards you at all. Between this site and All the others I could count on one hand the threads I am currently in discussion with for tech information. People ask what we see and I give them honest opinions. I have scene and heard of main cap walk still with a girdle on a Duramax bottom end. In one case had more cap walk with a girdle then with out.
Cylinder pressure is another very large factor playing a roll in main cap walk. Tuning safe is a good friend to have for engine life. Which brings up a good point with Matt's post on the big guys.
Keep in mind the Duramax block is laid out completely different then what you are comparing to.
They are dealing with a garden hose for fuel when compared to CR, which is why we can get away with more compression then a P-pump/sigma setup. Cylinder pressure is more critical then an internally balanced rotating assembly. Two motors same level of hp same guy tuning one internally balanced one not, bearing and cap wear look identical.
IMHO internally balanced motors help but not the solution to the Duramax bottom end problem. I scene an internally balanced motor fail in 500 miles and 8 passes on the dyno.
All the 7.3 powerstrokes and in line 6 tractor stuff that we do are girdled or have a bed plate of some sort. Different Block/main cap design then the duramax. The 6.4 Powerstroke has a factory bed plate which is partial reason to why the 6.4 guys are getting away with higher hp numbers on stock bottom end motors over the duramax guys, and there current tuning tables are far from par to what the Duramax community has.
So we take a block that is supposedly flexing on the high hp setups, take that tie it to all the main caps in-particular to a #2 main cap that so many have scene be tied to crank/bearing failure, walking etc, and tie it all together to create perfect harmony......:hug:
I already know my next solution... John Deere blocks have been proven to lots of power, I will find an old JD Prostock engine and run a BIG single, for no more than it pays I might as well have some fun with it and make a half dozen hooks a year for some real FUN!!! I won't have to worry near as much about the crank or block...
And I will still be able to pull ECI locally in the open class!!!
And I will still be able to pull ECI locally in the open class!!!
Main cap walk is not what most people think it is. It isn't the cap moving axially front and back as a whole in the block. It is the cap tilting such that the bearing is now at an angle to the bearing surface of the crank. More of a rocking motion.
Theres a local guy here that pulls a OBS F-250 with a John deer Diesel under the hood, Does pretty good too
FYI We modded the upper pan for the center link....Might not be needed?
but with watching how the motor twist VIA the hood stack i wasnt taking any chances.
I assume you should over fill a little to accomidate for the oil pick up and drop of oil pan also?
Actually the pickup mounts to the girdle, so the relationship to the bottom of the pan is unchanged. Both the pan and the pickup are moved 1/2" away from the block.
Although the level on the dipstick will read 1/2" lower. Could always shorten the dipstick tube by that much....
on the cummins engines i build i use that girdle and it keeps the caps from walking. If the material is right the size dont do much justice, except fool the buyers into buying something they dont need...
Ya i forgot it mounted to the girdle
No biggie on the dipstickYes I know.....You and every motor that Steve cole builds too.
Sadly the answer for this is to build it and balance it right?
Im sorry but answers like that just bother me, Forums are here to share advice about the stuff and talk about what to do about it.IMHO
If your just going to brag about......Then that doesnt mean anything to me.
Ya i forgot it mounted to the girdle
Yes I know.....You and every motor that Steve cole builds too.
Sadly the answer for this is to build it and balance it right?
Im sorry but answers like that just bother me, Forums are here to share advice about the stuff and talk about what to do about it.IMHO
If your just going to brag about......Then that doesnt mean anything to me.
Lol, :spit: I was wondering what your take on the above subject was after reading the comp D LLY thread
Thats funny right there. i did not need a girdle in my race engine because of all the weight that was taken out and the fact that i filled the block up 100%, thats why i dont use a girdle. I also feel that internal ballance has several distinct advantages and does not reduce strength at all, reguardless of what steve the pole smoker says..
Steve cole would f up a wet dream....
Steve cole would f up a wet dream....
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You still banned from Comp D over that thread? I was enjoying the read :rofl:
I went against the grain and did a external balance! it was smooth as silk by a highly recommended builder.
Its no different that anyone elses results
same wear, same location.NOW, if you tell me i did it wrong then your no different then Steve!
tell me what i could do different would be appreciated though.
I asked you 2 experts this before and was IMO polite and accepting but it gets old