kryptonite race centerlink with heims

[N2BRK]

You still have leverage with any kit that puts the inner tie rod behind the centerlink.

that's what I was waiting for. The weak link is that the Kryptonite is a compromised system and not the be all end all that it was supposed to be back in '09 when I bought it. You can't have it all and all the time. I had stock, I had a 1.5" dia Super Diesel straight link, and I have the Kryptonite. They are all a compromise, and the weak link in my setup is a centerlink that rolls like stock, albeit with a little less force.

Although I added front end parts to fix this, I have to give credit to Caltracs. I think that they alone could have fixed this. They keep the front end down really well.

 

[Vsouth]

I have run the kryptoite competition front end for 5 years. Close to 1000 1/4 mile passes at 800+ horsepower. More street play than I care to say. Was driven everyday for a long time. Close to 100k miles on it. Still going strong.

 

[Chevy1925]

that's what I was waiting for. The weak link is that the Kryptonite is a compromised system and not the be all end all that it was supposed to be back in '09 when I bought it. You can't have it all and all the time. I had stock, I had a 1.5" dia Super Diesel straight link, and I have the Kryptonite. They are all a compromise, and the weak link in my setup is a centerlink that rolls like stock, albeit with a little less force.



Although I added front end parts to fix this, I have to give credit to Caltracs. I think that they alone could have fixed this. They keep the front end down really well.

I feel like you missed a lot of what I posted about and was just looking for what you wanted to read lol.

The weak link was trying to put ALL the stress on a single shear idler arm with a little help from a weak pitman arm (they are all weak in single shear unless it's the PPE bolted setup). I could say the braces may have stopped it but there are many other factors that can take place that even braces can't always stop.

Some people can anvils

 

[N2BRK]

I get what you are saying, but you missed where I was headed. Duk was incinuating that the High Roller was the weak point, and even you jumped on board with that writing how it wasn't all that it was cracked up to be. I'm running an idler much stronger than stock; it's the kryptonite that is allowing roll beyond what even the upgraded parts could handle. You can't just buy a Kryptonite centerlink and solve the problem because it's a compromise. You still need all of the same stuff you'd need for a stock centerlink if you want to beat on an 8000lb truck with power, unless you lower it or run a straight centerlink.

The double shear via cognito (hated them!) or DHD's method of introducing a roll stop is still needed if you don't run a straight centerlink.

Also, I'm not sure that I like the idea of involving the pitman in the support via cognito braces. Putting stresses there just doesn't sit well with me. But fortunately I have a setup without it that works well for me.

Too bad Exaxt got shot down by cognito so fast. I think we would have seen some great products by now.

 

[Chevy1925]

I get what you are saying, but you missed where I was headed. Duk was incinuating that the High Roller was the weak point, and even you jumped on board with that writing how it wasn't all that it was cracked up to be. I'm running an idler much stronger than stock; it's the kryptonite that is allowing roll beyond what even the upgraded parts could handle. You can't just buy a Kryptonite centerlink and solve the problem because it's a compromise. You still need all of the same stuff you'd need for a stock centerlink if you want to beat on an 8000lb truck with power, unless you lower it or run a straight centerlink.

The double shear via cognito (hated them!) or DHD's method of introducing a roll stop is still needed if you don't run a straight centerlink.

Also, I'm not sure that I like the idea of involving the pitman in the support via cognito braces. Putting stresses there just doesn't sit well with me. But fortunately I have a setup without it that works well for me.

Too bad Exaxt got shot down by cognito so fast. I think we would have seen some great products by now.

i got ya now.

btw, just for the record, ive never said that the kyptonite setup is the end all to end all, only that it is the best available setup we have currently. Forums take that and run with it thinking it gives you cake and lets you eat it too when it doesnt. its all compromise.

even a straight centerlink that uses stock style inner tie rods CAN hurt idler/pitman arms but its harder. look at the angle of the tie rod to the centerlink from the top, its trying to push the centerlink forward. there is still some leverage on the centerlink though MUCH less than anything behind the centerlink (if that makes sense).

the real fix is to move the idler/pitman arm toward the back of the truck using a straight centerlink with stock style inner tie rods. 0 leverage, stock ackermann angle, and stock bumpsteer. you cant fix that though cause there are a few big parts in the way lol. A lifted truck (not a leveled truck) could have something made to make that work though. i put some time into looking into a design that would work. at the time 5 years ago i didnt think it was possible. with what i know now, i may need to revisit it.

 

[N2BRK]

I actually think that YOU could. You have an excellent understanding of the situation and the effects. i jumped on the kryptonite to get back the predictable handling I lost due to bump steer from the straight link and the Ackerman at full lock. It's a damned good compromise, but needs something to stop the roll. It should have been a work in progress to come up with a better system but the company wound up just copying parts and offering warranty and pretty words.

Cognito has everyone by the balls with the double shear. I hoped someone would have figured out something fresh like maybe an additional arm etc.

For now I'm satisfied, but I have a lot of parts and money thrown at it instead of one elegant solution, lol.

 

[Chevy1925]

I actually think that YOU could. You have an excellent understanding of the situation and the effects. i jumped on the kryptonite to get back the predictable handling I lost due to bump steer from the straight link and the Ackerman at full lock. It's a damned good compromise, but needs something to stop the roll. It should have been a work in progress to come up with a better system but the company wound up just copying parts and offering warranty and pretty words.

Cognito has everyone by the balls with the double shear. I hoped someone would have figured out something fresh like maybe an additional arm etc.

For now I'm satisfied, but I have a lot of parts and money thrown at it instead of one elegant solution, lol.

ben (dmax mafia) had a 3rd arm setup he was building for the stock centerlinks but i dont know why didnt fully finish it. never bugged him about it at the time cause i was busy with other crap.

when time frees up after the NHRDA races, ill have to step back to that idea and see what i can come up with.

 

[Harbin_22]

Anyone know the reason they went with rack and pinion on the NBS 1500, but stayed with the junk setup ours have? Is R&P not strong enough? I really like they way my 1500 steers over my 2500

 

[Chevy1925]

Anyone know the reason they went with rack and pinion on the NBS 1500, but stayed with the junk setup ours have? Is R&P not strong enough? I really like they way my 1500 steers over my 2500

Correct. It is not physically strong enough. They had rack and pinion on 1500s when they went nbs in 1999 but only 2wd. Those were inherently weak as well. Even the new ones have a tough time standing up to some abuse from mid travel kits

I feel one could be made strong enough. It wouldn't be cheap though....

 

[Wikid]

Could just go full hydro. Plenty strong enough. Used the crap out of those on jeep crawlers. They got better were you can get some feedback to the wheel.

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[Chevy1925]

Could just go full hydro. Plenty strong enough. Used the crap out of those on jeep crawlers. They got better were you can get some feedback to the wheel.

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Illegal for on road use though

 

[Wikid]

Eh. Kinda a grey area. I had full hydro on my daily for 5 years and some of the guys i wheeled with were cops they knew what it was but told me i wont get in trouble for it. Unless its the cause for an accident. ie hose bursts

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[N2BRK]

kinda grey... until you cause an accident... well duh! Everything is legal till you get caught, lol. Given the size of our trucks and the power that we run, any at fault accident is likely to cause some serious bodily injury. Any lawyer worth his retainer would nail you to a cross. Running it in your mud/rock truck down the road to the trail is one thing, but exposing yourself to daily driven use like that is a bad idea IMHO

 

[Dukcaln]

In my post on page 1 I listed it as a Henderson. I bought that before Dmax store was reselling them.

:thumb:

 

[Dukcaln]

What was my weak link? LOL

Relying on a idler and pitman to fight the torq generated from the front end and the counter effect of the aftermarket center link and its physical effect on the entire system with out idler and pitman braces. There is a reason why this set up is so strong and comes with a pisk kit. Thru lots and R&D.

I have run the kryptoite competition front end for 5 years. Close to 1000 1/4 mile passes at 800+ horsepower. More street play than I care to say. Was driven everyday for a long time. Close to 100k miles on it. Still going strong.

Why you think his truck launches do true and over and over and over again up :thumb:

I get what you are saying, but you missed where I was headed. Duk was incinuating that the High Roller was the weak point, and even you jumped on board with that writing how it wasn't all that it was cracked up to be. I'm running an idler much stronger than stock; it's the kryptonite that is allowing roll beyond what even the upgraded parts could handle. You can't just buy a Kryptonite centerlink and solve the problem because it's a compromise. You still need all of the same stuff you'd need for a stock centerlink if you want to beat on an 8000lb truck with power, unless you lower it or run a straight centerlink.

The double shear via cognito (hated them!) or DHD's method of introducing a roll stop is still needed if you don't run a straight centerlink.

Also, I'm not sure that I like the idea of involving the pitman in the support via cognito braces. Putting stresses there just doesn't sit well with me. But fortunately I have a setup without it that works well for me.

Too bad Exaxt got shot down by cognito so fast. I think we would have seen some great products by now.

Did not say and or indicate that was the weak link, you assumed sir. My weak link reference was, you need to have the idler and pitman braces to get the full benefit of the entire system as without them, way too much stress and torg will cause them (idelr or pitman) to break, bend or shift. The pisk brackets do a tremendous job countering this. With out, its Russian roulette. Trust me.. I didn't like the pisk as well, because low speeds they can cause issues, and improperly set up... but with out them, I broke and bent too many parts as mentioned. Why I run them now, and have not looked back. Give a valid reason and educated one for not running them, that caused the issue you had with your set up? With out the pisk, that very thing will happen with the type center link and tie rods you had... again, why it comes in the kit.

kinda grey... until you cause an accident... well duh! Everything is legal till you get caught, lol. Given the size of our trucks and the power that we run, any at fault accident is likely to cause some serious bodily injury. Any lawyer worth his retainer would nail you to a cross. Running it in your mud/rock truck down the road to the trail is one thing, but exposing yourself to daily driven use like that is a bad idea IMHO

:woott:

 

[N2BRK]

>There is a reason why this set up is so strong and comes with a pisk kit. >Thru lots and R&D.

It didn't when I bought it. Actually, my PISK didn't even fit well on it. Besides, if you need a PISK then they haven't solved the problem and don't have a real solution to offer.


>Why you think his truck launches do true and over and over and over again

Because he's running a different Kryptonite front end, his front end is lower, and he's not running an 8000lb truck with heavy assed wheels and tires. Otherwise we are identical, LMAO

I can point to others with a straight link that launch like mad (myself in the past included), or plenty of folks with PISK and sleeves with the front dropped down on lighter trucks than mine, or guys with a stock centerlink, sleeves, and DHD brace at built engine power levels.


> idler and pitman braces to get the full benefit of the entire system as >without them, way too much stress and torg will cause them (idelr or >pitman) to break, bend or shift. The pisk brackets do a tremendous job >countering this. With out, its Russian roulette. Trust me.. I didn't like the

I think I covered this above. When I got mine Mike wasn't spec'ing the PISK bandaid. Also, I don't think that the Pitman should share in the stresses of stopping rotation of the centerlink.

> Give a valid reason and educated one for not running them, that caused the >issue you had with your set up? With out the pisk, that very thing will >happen with the type center link and tie rods you had... again, why it comes >in the kit.

I didn't need them at max effort stock trans at all. It was just after Mark dyno tuned my new setup and it lights so fast. Again, it did not come in the kit as there was no kit and they didn't fit well anyway, which amplified binding issues in parking lot maneuvers.

I have run everything from stock and braced, straight centerlink, and Kryptonite with/without braces and DHD brace. To do it all over, I'd start off with sleeves DHD brace and stock centerlink. I don't think it would have any problem and it would steer stock.

 

[Dukcaln]

>There is a reason why this set up is so strong and comes with a pisk kit. >Thru lots and R&D.

It didn't when I bought it. Actually, my PISK didn't even fit well on it. Besides, if you need a PISK then they haven't solved the problem and don't have a real solution to offer.


>Why you think his truck launches do true and over and over and over again

Because he's running a different Kryptonite front end, his front end is lower, and he's not running an 8000lb truck with heavy assed wheels and tires. Otherwise we are identical, LMAO

I can point to others with a straight link that launch like mad (myself in the past included), or plenty of folks with PISK and sleeves with the front dropped down on lighter trucks than mine, or guys with a stock centerlink, sleeves, and DHD brace at built engine power levels.


> idler and pitman braces to get the full benefit of the entire system as >without them, way too much stress and torg will cause them (idelr or >pitman) to break, bend or shift. The pisk brackets do a tremendous job >countering this. With out, its Russian roulette. Trust me.. I didn't like the

I think I covered this above. When I got mine Mike wasn't spec'ing the PISK bandaid. Also, I don't think that the Pitman should share in the stresses of stopping rotation of the centerlink.

> Give a valid reason and educated one for not running them, that caused the >issue you had with your set up? With out the pisk, that very thing will >happen with the type center link and tie rods you had... again, why it comes >in the kit.

I didn't need them at max effort stock trans at all. It was just after Mark dyno tuned my new setup and it lights so fast. Again, it did not come in the kit as there was no kit and they didn't fit well anyway, which amplified binding issues in parking lot maneuvers.

I have run everything from stock and braced, straight centerlink, and Kryptonite with/without braces and DHD brace. To do it all over, I'd start off with sleeves DHD brace and stock centerlink. I don't think it would have any problem and it would steer stock.

The kits now come with them, and for sometime they have, remember, I said lots of R&D went into the kits, or many trial and error breaks and miss fortunes for owners transpired.. Never said your kit came with them,rather implied without them now there was a weak link and the reason the kits now (key word bud) come with them, is because of the identifying factors mentioned :hug:


V-runs the race on his race truck and the other on his pull truck, which is a back up to him and has seen the track.

Ok Boss... you know best for your mind set, I have nothing for ya. keep on :woott:

 

[Dukcaln]

Too add, lots of guys run, sleeves and center link with a brace, or sleeves and centerlink with out, or tie rods, with center link and brace or no brace, or sleeves and center link with pisk and no gusset or aftermarket idler, some run the entire set up, full tilt.... And some break, some don't. Any set up can have failure, and any set up may not, seen stock set ups last 100's of passes.

You wondered why... hope it clarifies it.... no on set up or system is bullet proof. if it works for you, congrats bud.... I am happy for you :thumb:

 

[Chevy1925]

Eh. Kinda a grey area. I had full hydro on my daily for 5 years and some of the guys i wheeled with were cops they knew what it was but told me i wont get in trouble for it. Unless its the cause for an accident. ie hose bursts

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States where you annual inspections will not let you pass either. You must have a mechanical attachment to the steering of the vehicle in case a hydraulic part fails.

Don't get me wrong, full hydro steering has come a long ways but you have a hose fail, fitting fail, or seal fail, you are screwed. An argument can be made about the pitman arms breaking a long while back but pump and seal failures are WELL higher than those failures.

Wouldn't matter anyhow as the ram is too damn big to fit where it needs to.

 

[Wikid]

Guess thats true the state i had it in didn't require an inspection. I went through my system pretty regularly anyway. But you are correct you cant fit a ram where you need it. Really cant fit the orbital valve where it wouldnt get roasted. Kinda wish gm had stuck with solid front axles.

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