Kryptonite Centerlink vs. PPE

[RedHotGMC]

Again i say your cup is too full dude. My truck run on 35s and still puts audis thru the ringer and the facts you say you speak of seem to be based solely off your experiences as well. And maybe some info you got comfortable enough to regurgitate good for you. What you think cuz my avatar says 2 day member and 5 posts you think ive not been around the block? I love guys like you. I got some oceanfront property in az if you are interested !maybe we be close enough to let the trucks talk as for this subject it dead no more worthless words you can have the last one i hope some good thoughts and ideas came from all this banter Peace to all but prius owners ha

what point are you trying to get across? all you do is ramble, so far all i have gathered from all your rambling is keep the stock centerlink and go with cognito braces and my ride will corner and steer like an audi? If cognito braces were the answer then why would companies go out of there way to come up with something different?

 

[super diesel]

Cognito supports are limited in there power handling and that's been proven time and time again. If they weren't we wouldn't have so many broken ones and bent ones out there and the folks running REAL SERIOUS power would be using them safely on the track and at the pulls. Not happening, and it wont as long as they don't improve there product one bit. If there bought knowing there limited capabilities, that's fine. They DO flex under moderate power though and can weaken, crack and break do to stress flexing from this. They need to be twice a thick in the die formed steel area to be higher power worthy. But when you use form dies your limited on steel thickness. Sorry if this offends. Truth hurts. Quite a few of us have passed this point along time ago.

 

[Chevy1925]

the braces work for most but start pushing the truck in power/lifted/off roading and its not long they start to show they cant handle it. Ive never said "cognito braces dont work for everyone out there in the GM world"

Thank god some is listening. My whole point was grandpa pullin a fifth wheel does not need solid centerlink the bracket kit works well for the street with moderate power levels or as prolonging part failure and having a bettter steering vehicle that feels connected to the road

Apparently you just cant handle hearing it from me. Ive already stated that but you got such a hard on for me you missed it.

 

[Chevy1925]

This is the point - these aftermarket parts are designed for A specific purpose the guys only care about enhanceing one area like wieght transfer while sled pullin think albout it when do you apply the force needed for the product to be used for its intended design you can over build your rig. Not in a good way unless you plan to hook to a sled or rip down the track with built motor hp andl you have to do alot more than the cognito pit idler suppt kit to roll a full size truck on 35's thru corners @ double the caution speed . Btwl 1925chevy the kryprtonite kit i just helped my friend install on his road course d-max works amazing but i still wont put it on my street truck.

Thats great you dont want it. I dont care, its your choice.

 

[hondarider552]

Is this diesel place?

 

[Chevy1925]

It funny this whole time i have been advocating both products for much diff reasons and applications. You my not so friend seem to be the only one having a problem being disagreed with please save the erotic commentary as it does not help to get your point across the only two thing i get a hard on for is my wifes tits and ass fag keep dreamin ha ha thanks for the oil temp gauge tip btw good advice

You can call me names all you like. Wont bother me. But again, your putting words in my mouth, what was it i disagree with you on?

 

[Chevy1925]

As far as which centerlink is better idk i like the kryptonite kit because the pieces were designed as a package sold as a kit works like a champ on road course i have not used another centerlink except a ppe we took out after the first day. It did not work well for us. Seemed to be more suited for sled pull
And 1/4 mi not corners. Sorry guys no solid facts here just personal experience and how it felt by the seat monitor we did drop 7 sec off our lap time once the front end was dialed in.

So you really cant tell why the krytonite full steering setup is different than a ppe centerlink? Because, yes, the ppe centerlink aint gunna help you at all in road course and it is different than the krytonite setup

 

[Chevy1925]

My first post.that is when you disagreed disrespected and started all the baack and forth with me . Im not thin skined either just think you sound a little arrogant. take care.

Well sparky, thats cause i dont know one centerlink that is too stiff to cause tire scrub or cause everything in the front end to wear out. Again, sorry you like to be told to get your facts straight and correct but life hurts sometimes.

 

[Krtc]

I would like to chime in on this thread if I may..... I have broken 3 pitman arm bolts now. All three were while running the cognito supports. I have a 05 DMAX 6" RCD, 35" tires with relaxed angles and heim joint tie rods. I wheel my truck mild and use it for work everyday. I have rebuilt my front end 3 times - new ball joints, new stock draglink, supersteer support and so on. I have had it with these pitman arms breaking. I am lucky to be alive.

Here is how I see it - The cognito brace is putting direct force on the bolt of the pitman arm right above the draglink. Because the draglink has a curve in it, it creates leverage... this leverage creates force and twist.... the job of the pitman arm is to absorb this. But if the cognito brace is on, it stops the ball joint inside from flexing... so where does the force go.... right to the bolt! Am I crazy? Why is no one seeing this? Another problem is the braces hit the frame when in full turn.... (I welded stops on my spindles to prevent this...) When the brace hits the frame - guess where the force goes - to the bolt.

I really feel the brace on the pitman arm is a problem. I would rather have the ball joint wear, then break a bolt. This last time it broke the truck felt solid as a rock... no warning signs.... because of the brace... this is dangerous.

the exaxt kit does not run a pitman arm support - does Mac see what I'm seeing?

any thoughts?

 

[Chevy1925]

Well you definitely have it all figured out i feel o just so lucky to have had your input today- cheers

:thumb:. thanks for the nice visitor message as well! :hello:

 

[Chevy1925]

I would like to chime in on this thread if I may..... I have broken 3 pitman arm bolts now. All three were while running the cognito supports. I have a 05 DMAX 6" RCD, 35" tires with relaxed angles and heim joint tie rods. I wheel my truck mild and use it for work everyday. I have rebuilt my front end 3 times - new ball joints, new stock draglink, supersteer support and so on. I have had it with these pitman arms breaking. I am lucky to be alive.

Here is how I see it - The cognito brace is putting direct force on the bolt of the pitman arm right above the draglink. Because the draglink has a curve in it, it creates leverage... this leverage creates force and twist.... the job of the pitman arm is to absorb this. But if the cognito brace is on, it stops the ball joint inside from flexing... so where does the force go.... right to the bolt! Am I crazy? Why is no one seeing this? Another problem is the braces hit the frame when in full turn.... (I welded stops on my spindles to prevent this...) When the brace hits the frame - guess where the force goes - to the bolt.

I really feel the brace on the pitman arm is a problem. I would rather have the ball joint wear, then break a bolt. This last time it broke the truck felt solid as a rock... no warning signs.... because of the brace... this is dangerous.

the exaxt kit does not run a pitman arm support - does Mac see what I'm seeing?

any thoughts?

the whole goal of the supports is to stop the centerlink from rotating due to the leverage induced by the tie rods and angles on the centerlink. your putting the centerlink in a double sheer situation to keep from rotating. Now, if the braces are not adjusted correctly, they can add added stress to the pitman arm and ilder arm joint that can make them sheer/brake.

What pitman arms are you running? stock, GM? how many miles till they break? the braces hitting the frame and causing a twist does not help your situation.

 

[Krtc]

All three were Moog. I installed the braces carefully every time, loose then tighten to ensure no binding.

The brace is grabbing the bottom of the bolt... this keeps the balljoint from flexing. Like a knee brace. But the force is so tremendous, something has to give. The bolt - right? I can see how the exaxt and krptonite link will minimize this rotation. This is a better answer in my eyes than the brace. The brace on the idler has never been an issue. The idler is a pivot.... the pitman is taking more force - I think?

Without the brace, the bottom of the bolt can move with the ball joint inside. But with the brace it has no where to go. All three cracked right between the piman and the link... the only place it can flex.

from 30 - 15k between breaks roughly. I fixed the brace from hitting the frame by welding stops (1/4" plate) on the spindle to lessen a full rotation. But still broke.

Plus, I feel if the brace bends from stress over time, it creates a binding effect as it works against the idler brace.... all three braces were bent to shit when I removed them. (could have happend after pitman broke, not sure)

 

[Chevy1925]

All three were Moog. I installed the braces carefully every time, loose then tighten to ensure no binding.

The brace is grabbing the bottom of the bolt... this keeps the balljoint from flexing. Like a knee brace. But the force is so tremendous, something has to give. The bolt - right? I can see how the exaxt and krptonite link will minimize this rotation. This is a better answer in my eyes than the brace. The brace on the idler has never been an issue. The idler is a pivot.... the pitman is taking more force - I think?

Without the brace, the bottom of the bolt can move with the ball joint inside. But with the brace it has no where to go. All three cracked right between the piman and the link... the only place it can flex.

i can see the bolt taking a big load as your talking about IF the pitman arm is worn to allow back and forth movement. then the braces are trying to stop the twist all by them selves. ive heard of the moog pitman arms breaking on people but ive not heard of the GM ones breaking accept for one fellow long ago. it almost sounds like the moog pitman arm is not as tight as they use to be to stop rotation, thus letting the braces take the load and breaking the bolt but without being there to see or having a go-pro watch the centerlink try to twist with a new pitman arm on it with and without braces, its hard to justify that that is the issue. it is an idea though.

 

[D-MAX Mafia]

You can throw braces under the idler and pitman arm all you want but your not fixing the problem.

It is possible to run a stock centerlink (or stock like) with the proper modifications and keep the wheels straight at launch. No tire scrub or lack of turning radius also.

There is also something you can do to really fix the problem but its not out yet. But its coming. Guys with lifts and big tires are gonna love it.

 

[Krtc]

Funny, I thought of the go pro idea.... My other idea was simpler... make a tab with a sharp point on it mounted to the draglink. Then have the point rest against a stationary plate and inspect the scratches it creates....

On all three pitman I removed, when I locked them in a vice and cranked on it, they seemed solid. The brace seemed to do its job by saving the ball joint.

I am trying to create something that can be attached to the pitman and draglink, which if a breakage occurs, will capture the pitman arm and allow the driver to control the truck instead of throwing into oncoming traffic.

The whole truck is relying on a 1/2" bolt.... bad design.

thanks for all the input!

 

[Krtc]

D-max-Mafia - Is it a straight axle? just kiddin - can't wait to see what your taking about...

 

[Chevy1925]

You can throw braces under the idler and pitman arm all you want but your not fixing the problem.

It is possible to run a stock centerlink (or stock like) with the proper modifications and keep the wheels straight at launch. No tire scrub or lack of turning radius also.

There is also something you can do to really fix the problem but its not out yet. But its coming. Guys with lifts and big tires are gonna love it.

I saw your braces that are coming out. Im interested to see how they will hold up being the leverage on the steering system has not been reduced via a different centerlink like other kits that run a single brace.

 

[D-MAX Mafia]

I saw your braces that are coming out. Im interested to see how they will hold up being the leverage on the steering system has not been reduced via a different centerlink like other kits that run a single brace.

They are holding up very well. Still running the same Napa idler arm, pivot and pitman arm for the last 2 years with zero play. I installed the first support 2 months after installing the new arms and pivot. The final revision really made it stout.

There is still leverage on the centerlink at launch and normal driving. But containing the leverage is the objective here. Its just like a 3 link on a straight axle. Its trying to rotate but the placement of the links keeps this from happening.

Remember this is a steering centerlink not an axle. There is a lot less rotational force to stop. But thats only half the problem. There is still a lot of flex in the pivot and steering box. Idler arm and pitman arm braces wont stop the flex.

 

[hondarider552]

.

There is also something you can do to really fix the problem but its not out yet. But its coming. Guys with lifts and big tires are gonna love it.

interested to see the results

 

[hondarider552]

My braces dont even have stress cracks in the gloss black paint at 100+k mi and severe driving habits i am not skayin they are that great but what gives

I bent mine on my set on my LBZ major offset wheels do play a major role in the front end. I had 50k mile son them when I sold the truck.

how can i have such good experience with this product on several rigs when others have such a crap experience with one rig and the same product ?

How many times have you taken your truck down the track in 4wd? That is the difference. :thumb: