alligator or dmax store

[RoboF16]

All the "Stg V" kits are the same as far as I know, to include the converter - (PPE, Alligator, and DMAX store) which includes Alto and Transgo parts.
It's a popular kit because it works, Mike L. was consulted in the update, and the ML converter is super versatile.
As far as my research goes, there are only two clutch options I'd consider Suncoast or Alto. Look at Mike's signature.

That being said, there is A LOT of prep that goes in to an Allison build and it's so much more than just deciding what parts you plan to use. I literally spent months studying a little at a time trying to grasp how everything works just in case I had a problem.

 

[diesel53]

All the "Stg V" kits are the same as far as I know, to include the converter - (PPE, Alligator, and DMAX store) which includes Alto and Transgo parts.
It's a popular kit because it works, Mike L. was consulted in the update, and the ML converter is super versatile.
As far as my research goes, there are only two clutch options I'd consider Suncoast or Alto. Look at Mike's signature.

That being said, there is A LOT of prep that goes in to an Allison build and it's so much more than just deciding what parts you plan to use. I literally spent months studying a little at a time trying to grasp how everything works just in case I had a problem.

Thanks for the info.. Im just getting a feel for whats available and I am kind of waiting to see if the other clutch kits Mike is testing will come out for purchase anytime soon. Ive already decided on a converter.

I will not tackle the build myself, and I agree it would take ALOT of prep work.

 

[duratothemax]

There is a difference between "building" an allison and "assembling" an allison...JMO

 

[duramini2001]

I'm about ready to buy my tranny kit and I have been looking at the dmax store stage v and the alligator performance stage 5. What is the difference ? Has anyone run theese kits? What are your guys thoughts thanks.

Personally i wouldnt put an alligator kit in my gas 350 chevy!!, there kits are based around stock apply plates and pistons for the c3 and c4, 6 on 5 clutch on steel!!! throw a shim for pressure and a lock up valve and poof a tranny for 550 horse if thats what your looking for!! I would call mike for any further help and to build your tranny, just FYI mike built my trans 1700+ horse 9.9 at 140 down the quarter mile in a crew cab 7100 pounds, as i have had it out and changed a couple small things the build remains the same with mike on the phone as i need him, couldnt be where i am today with out his help, you want an alligator product?? buy a h@s tunner or a down pipe, just my opinion tho:thumb:

 

[duramini2001]

All the "Stg V" kits are the same as far as I know, to include the converter - (PPE, Alligator, and DMAX store) which includes Alto and Transgo parts.
It's a popular kit because it works, Mike L. was consulted in the update, and the ML converter is super versatile.
As far as my research goes, there are only two clutch options I'd consider Suncoast or Alto. Look at Mike's signature.

That being said, there is A LOT of prep that goes in to an Allison build and it's so much more than just deciding what parts you plan to use. I literally spent months studying a little at a time trying to grasp how everything works just in case I had a problem.

NO there not the same kit!! there is a difference between PPE and ALLIGATOR, PPE actually comes with apply plates and pistons for the c3 c4 packs and ALLIGATOR does not, PPE uses a different converter than alligator as well!

 

[MrUPS]

They are not the same as the Suncoast kit. I re designed it last year for Alto.
The truth is there is only two Alto kits and everybody buys them.
Distrubutors set a minimum sell price to the public to protect all their dealers from whores who are willing to make 5.00 per sale because they sell out of their garage or their trucks.They have no overhead and don't pay taxes. They pocket all the money.
The whores will sell the same kit without a name to stay out of trouble so they can compete with all the other whores working out of their garages and trucks.
You can always spot a whore when you see huge bright pictures in their sig.

That's a lot of whores! ostwhore:

 

[RoboF16]

NO there not the same kit!! there is a difference between PPE and ALLIGATOR, PPE actually comes with apply plates and pistons for the c3 c4 packs and ALLIGATOR does not, PPE uses a different converter than alligator as well!

I think Alligator uses Alto Powerpacks which include machined apply plates and bonded apply pistons where applicable, like C3 and C4.
If they don't, that is a very poor kit indeed.
My understanding is that their converter is a ML painted green like PPE's is a ML painted white.

 

[Mike L.]

All my converters from now on will be exclusive. I will have a couple of hand picked dealers.

 

[Bobo]

All my converters from now on will be exclusive. I will have a couple of hand picked dealers.

You mean these Revmax ones aren't made by you? I thought you liked red.:roflmao:

 

[dieseltwodoor]

Always top notch service at dmax store


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk while riding porcelain.

 

[duramini2001]

I think Alligator uses Alto Powerpacks which include machined apply plates and bonded apply pistons where applicable, like C3 and C4.
If they don't, that is a very poor kit indeed.
My understanding is that their converter is a ML painted green like PPE's is a ML painted white.

I have personally installed their kit, the use stock apply plates on the c3 c4 to cut down on cost, as i said you want a good 550 horse kit their ya go, their c3 and c4 are alot power packs but the cheaper ones that do not include the apply plate, piston ect.. instead they cut the pressure plate way down and stack one extra clutch and steal purchased seperate!! I will speak my mind 100 percent on this matter, their are a few good tranny builders out there and a few good companies that sell good product and these mass "whores" get the same rep as the good guys, with much worse product!! you can see that just by reading this thread where people compare alligator to ppe and otheres!!

 

[Bustedknuckles]

NO there not the same kit!! there is a difference between PPE and ALLIGATOR, PPE actually comes with apply plates and pistons for the c3 c4 packs and ALLIGATOR does not, PPE uses a different converter than alligator as well!

I bought the Dmax-4 kit from dmaxstore. They claim PPE kit and ML converter. Is that a good or bad thing? Its been doing great for over a year fwiw.

 

[othrgrl]

I couldn't agree more with every word Dmitri has said. I had customers calling to ask if I would build with an Alligator kit to save them money; it wouldn't save them money anyway, but I called and talked to Guyton to get the details on the kit and found out they do not include a thicker or hardened C3 or C4 apply plate.

Alto supplied SC with clutches, SC did the R&D to develope and machine the plates and make an SC IV kit, Alto reverse engineered it (knocked it off), and started selling it to all of their dealers (PPE being one of the biggest). They screwed it up at first and Mike has since helped them fix it and gotten away from the SC IV knock off. Now you have other sales places cutting corners and making knock offs of knock offs and guys buy it up thinking they are getting an SC IV kit at a great price...

At 500-550 rwhp a good allison builder could make it hold for quite a while with stock clutches and clutch count; obviously any kit with at least stock quality clutches should also hold up to that, but what are you paying for then?

 

[duramini2001]

I couldn't agree more with every word Dmitri has said. I had customers calling to ask if I would build with an Alligator kit to save them money; it wouldn't save them money anyway, but I called and talked to Guyton to get the details on the kit and found out they do not include a thicker or hardened C3 or C4 apply plate.

Alto supplied SC with clutches, SC did the R&D to develope and machine the plates and make an SC IV kit, Alto reverse engineered it (knocked it off), and started selling it to all of their dealers (PPE being one of the biggest). They screwed it up at first and Mike has since helped them fix it and gotten away from the SC IV knock off. Now you have other sales places cutting corners and making knock offs of knock offs and guys buy it up thinking they are getting an SC IV kit at a great price...

At 500-550 rwhp a good allison builder could make it hold for quite a while with stock clutches and clutch count; obviously any kit with at least stock quality clutches should also hold up to that, but what are you paying for then?

Well said dustin ^^^^:thumb::thumb: Im glad im not the only one out there that thinks these knock off kits like alligator and other places are selling are bull shit!!!!! and the worst part about it is they advertise it at 800 rwhp lol, you have got to be f****** kidding me, That kit would be lucky to make 3 passes at 800 horse, hell even 750 horse!!

 

[Bryce418]

At 500-550 rwhp a good allison builder could make it hold for quite a while with stock clutches and clutch count; obviously any kit with at least stock quality clutches should also hold up to that, but what are you paying for then?

Yup, have a buddy running 500 on stock clutches, a transgo kit and single plate converter. It's. Even hanging in there for at least 20-30k miles and still going strong.


Now a tranny that will hang at 800+ is a whole different animal.

 

[duratothemax]

At 500-550 rwhp a good allison builder could make it hold for quite a while with stock clutches and clutch count;

Friend of mine has an 05 LLY CC/SB with an aurora 5000, PPE lift pump, max effort tuning, lifted 4-6" on 35's. I built him a trans with stock clutches and stock clutch count, triple disc converter, transgo, and a couple other little things. He has close to 100,000 miles and almost 5 years of big-turbo abuse on it......zero problems. I dont think he has ever sled pulled, but hes made a couple dozen passes down the 1/4 mile.

 

[othrgrl]

Friend of mine has an 05 LLY CC/SB with an aurora 5000, PPE lift pump, max effort tuning, lifted 4-6" on 35's. I built him a trans with stock clutches and stock clutch count, triple disc converter, transgo, and a couple other little things. He has close to 100,000 miles and almost 5 years of big-turbo abuse on it......zero problems. I dont think he has ever sled pulled, but hes made a couple dozen passes down the 1/4 mile.

No offense intended at all Ben, but on stock fuel system with an A5K you will loose some of your low end torque, which will actually be a little easier on the clutches. While we all give hp limits for the trans and engine, low end torque is usually what hurts things. WOT runs are also easier than high gear and low RPM pulls for the same reason.

 

[duratothemax]

No offense intended at all Ben, but on stock fuel system with an A5K you will loose some of your low end torque, which will actually be a little easier on the clutches. While we all give hp limits for the trans and engine, low end torque is usually what hurts things. WOT runs are also easier than high gear and low RPM pulls for the same reason.

He ran a stock turbo for about 20,000 miles on the "built" trans before the A5k.........

 

[x MadMAX DIESEL]

Maybe totally wrong... But I think Idaho rob ran 11s with stock clutches. Don't know how many, how long it held etc. But pretty sure he did it... Steve Cole also has said long ago they can work fine with the right upgrades. Bumping up main line pressure surely does help, that's what copilots do when hooked up fully.

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[Mike L.]

Maybe totally wrong... But I think Idaho rob ran 11s with stock clutches. Don't know how many, how long it held etc. But pretty sure he did it... Steve Cole also has said long ago they can work fine with the right upgrades. Bumping up main line pressure surely does help, that's what copilots do when hooked up fully.

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Rob ran 300+ psi pump pressure with no knock down and a snake oiler. Not sure if he ran an extra clutch in C3 but I think he did.
Remember some Alli's can get away with this and some can't.