LB7 Blown head gasket and/or injector cups Part 2 after closed thread!~

[fishv12]

Good day all,

Alright so here it goes my upper rad hose is having a hard on. Truck is a 2002 with a little over 120,000miles. I bouth it 20k miles ago and as far as I know it's been stock but that is hard to tell.

Now I have to replace either the head gaskets and/or injector cups which I am simply thinking about doing both but I am a noob and need help. I am good with a wrench and have the will the learn. Need help with this job and I just want ppl posting that has done this job themselves not looked at someone do it. Serious posts only! I would like to refer people to my old thread since there is alot that has been said already and my thread has been closed because of misconduct which pissed me off but whatever. http://www.duramaxdiesels.com/forum/showthread.php?t=43601

In the mean time I have failed to find myself a beater car which totally sucks. Had my hopes on a 2004 Epica with 100k miles yesterday but after playing with it for a while I figured it has a bad valve/piston ring or guess what head gasket since it's blowing exhaust gases through the oil filler hole like crazy. I bought parts to fix it too thinking it was in good shape :S Just my luck lol!

 

[duramatt05]

I did mine myself. Make sure u take ur time label electrical connectors when u take them apart. Definatly have ur heads plained and check for cracks. (My one head ended up having a crack.) Just don't rush urself.

 

[MACKIN]

Not aware of your location but perhaps there is a member or two here who has experience in doing a HG job that can lend a hand for pizza and beer?

Definitely have the heads checked for surface imperfections. In addition anything else mentioned here from others findings. You do NOT want to do this twice I assume over couple hundred bucks.

 

[Chevy1925]

its not a fun job by any means. if you pull the heads, you will need to reseal the injector cups anyhow.

Like said above, make sure you label all bolts, tag electrical, and if it seems like removing another part would make it easier to get to what ever it is you need to remove, REMOVE IT lol. you will find you waist more time trying to finagle something around a part thats in the way then just removing whats in your way first.

Also, make sure you take the heads to a reputable machine shop. If the heads need to be cut down alot (more than .010 or .015, cant remember off the top of my head) you will need to have the valves recessed into the heads more to avoid the piston hitting them.

 

[adeso]

Check out randysperformanceautomotive.ca seems close to you, don't know how good they are

 

[adeso]

If the cup is really stuck to the injector just replace it, they are only about $20. You can make a cup puller for cheap if you can't find a shop with one

 

[fishv12]

First I would like to appologize I was just a little pissed with my first thread and all going south.

It definetely seems logical to get my heads checked now. When comes closer to time I will call everyone to find a shop. Also what I read elsewhere to get your injectors calibrated and rockers recorrect me if I wrong.

I have a few questions and hopefully you guys can shed some light on them all.

Once I take out EVERYTHING around the engine which goes without saying I will get to the engine. That part doesn't even scare me the least btw. It's what fallows that I need help with since I never went any farther than replacing a valve cover gasket on a BMW. First when removing the fuel lines on top of the valve cover. Looking at them they are locked in by some kind of indexed metal plate around the nut. How easy is to take that out? Then as for the glow plugs does these go out at that point as well before removing the valve cover or is this done after. How easy is to remove these from what I read they break easy.

Now once the valve cover is off do I go right ahead and take out the heads and worry about taking out the injectors, rocker arms, glow plugs, etc. out of the truck or do I have to do this with the heads in. It would seem much easier just to pull the head and work on it on my work bench.

As for putting all the parts back in can you reseat the cups/injectors/rocker arms with the heads out or that has to be done heads in. Again trying to be more comfortable who can blame me!

Now I found a tool for removing the cups which can be found at this thread:
http://www.duramaxdiesels.com/forum/showthread.php?t=31371

When pulling the injectors how easy is that? What is the trick to it? I read about using a socket and a flat blade screwdriver using the screw driver as a lever resting on the socket. Doesn't sound too bad.

As far as pulling the cup goes the tool above can be used but what about putting them back in. I read something about beating them in using a rubber mallet and a wooden dowel slightly bigger than the cups themselves. Can the dowel fit in the cup? I plan on just replacing all cups since they can be trouble prone too unless someone tells me it's absolutely unneccessary.

As far as torque specs I will need pretty much all the torque specs for the LB7 to do the job. I read somewhere that you torque the ARP fasteners down to 125ft/lbs loosen and tighten back 3 times. I have yet to find the sequence which I am sure there is one.

As for valve lash this is new territory that I need to research. Apparently you need to back it off before removing the rocker shaft. Then re-adjust heads in. I have absolutely no idea on doing that and not sure if it's the same but 11 thousand of an inch is what is recommended on the LLY.

For head gaskets I have no plan on ever modding my truck so should I just get whatever grade I need when I find out while pulling the truck apart. I have read that many just go with grade C.

I think I have enough questions for now... I will wait and see. As far as the parts I was just thinking about contacting Merchant Automotive and getting them to send me all I need in a box.


Mackin:
If I knew anyone around town that is just willing to lend a hand for pizza and beer they would be welcome to eat steak on the grill anytime at my place! Seriously!

Adeso:
Thank you for finding somewhere to give a call to. I will definetely check them out. If nothing can be found I will ship the heads to you and pay you back for whatever it cost and more for your trouble. The way I look at it once I have another daily commuter I have tons of time on my hands to handle the job.

 

[JoshH]

First I would like to appologize I was just a little pissed with my first thread and all going south.

It definetely seems logical to get my heads checked now. When comes closer to time I will call everyone to find a shop. Also what I read elsewhere to get your injectors calibrated and rockers recorrect me if I wrong.

I have a few questions and hopefully you guys can shed some light on them all.

Once I take out EVERYTHING around the engine which goes without saying I will get to the engine. That part doesn't even scare me the least btw. It's what fallows that I need help with since I never went any farther than replacing a valve cover gasket on a BMW. First when removing the fuel lines on top of the valve cover. Looking at them they are locked in by some kind of indexed metal plate around the nut. How easy is to take that out? There is a small 8mm headed bolt that holds the plate down. It is very easy to remove once you get everything out of the way.Then as for the glow plugs does these go out at that point as well before removing the valve cover or is this done after. How easy is to remove these from what I read they break easy.You can wait until after the valve cover is off to remove the glow plugs, but the wires that run to and from them need to be removed before you pull the valve cover. I've never had any trouble removing glow plugs, but if you live in an area that uses salt or other corosives on the road, you may have trouble getting them out. If that is the case, use penetrating oil and be careful.

Now once the valve cover is off do I go right ahead and take out the heads and worry about taking out the injectors, rocker arms, glow plugs, etc. out of the truck or do I have to do this with the heads in. It would seem much easier just to pull the head and work on it on my work bench.I always remove the injectors, rockers, and glow plugs before I pull the head. I usually leave the exhaust and intake manifolds until after, but sometimes I will pull the exhaust manifold before, just depends on what kind of mood I'm in.

As for putting all the parts back in can you reseat the cups/injectors/rocker arms with the heads out or that has to be done heads in. Again trying to be more comfortable who can blame me! I guess it depends on how you pull them, but I don't like to torque head bolts or studs with injectors in the way if I can help it.

Now I found a tool for removing the cups which can be found at this thread:
http://www.duramaxdiesels.com/forum/showthread.php?t=31371

When pulling the injectors how easy is that? What is the trick to it? I read about using a socket and a flat blade screwdriver using the screw driver as a lever resting on the socket. Doesn't sound too bad. They usually aren't too bad as long as they aren't stuck in the cup.

As far as pulling the cup goes the tool above can be used but what about putting them back in. I read something about beating them in using a rubber mallet and a wooden dowel slightly bigger than the cups themselves. Can the dowel fit in the cup? I plan on just replacing all cups since they can be trouble prone too unless someone tells me it's absolutely unneccessary. You don't need to replace the cups unless they are damaged. Just clean them and the head sealing surface, and reseal them. When I install them, I slide them over the pulling tool and use that to tap them into place with a hammer. They should go in relatively easy. Once you have them installed, you need to install your injectors and torque the hold down bolt. Also, make sure you use Loctite 272 or GM cup sealing stuff. I've read where a few people say they have used some CAT injector cup sealer also.

As far as torque specs I will need pretty much all the torque specs for the LB7 to do the job. I read somewhere that you torque the ARP fasteners down to 125ft/lbs loosen and tighten back 3 times. I have yet to find the sequence which I am sure there is one. All the torque specs can be found in the GM Specs section of the site. If you are installing ARP studs, they should come with torque procedure.

As for valve lash this is new territory that I need to research. Apparently you need to back it off before removing the rocker shaft. Then re-adjust heads in. I have absolutely no idea on doing that and not sure if it's the same but 11 thousand of an inch is what is recommended on the LLY. You don't have to loosen them before you pull the rockers. I always leave them alone until I get ready to adjust them. I believe the factory spec on rocker clearance is .012".

For head gaskets I have no plan on ever modding my truck so should I just get whatever grade I need when I find out while pulling the truck apart. I have read that many just go with grade C. Many people do just buy Grade C gaskets and throw them in, and it is fine.

I think I have enough questions for now... I will wait and see. As far as the parts I was just thinking about contacting Merchant Automotive and getting them to send me all I need in a box.


Mackin:
If I knew anyone around town that is just willing to lend a hand for pizza and beer they would be welcome to eat steak on the grill anytime at my place! Seriously!

Adeso:
Thank you for finding somewhere to give a call to. I will definetely check them out. If nothing can be found I will ship the heads to you and pay you back for whatever it cost and more for your trouble. The way I look at it once I have another daily commuter I have tons of time on my hands to handle the job.

Answers above in red.

 

[adeso]

Get someone with a programer, EFI or a tech II to read your balance rates before you pull the engine apart. If it is running like crap is will throw it off anyways, but if it is just pushing coolant when you run it hard should be able to get a good idea of how good your injectors are.
You don't want to send the heads to me, while they are not too bad to do (any good shop can handle it) I myself will check them, but send them off to be shaved if they need it (I'm not that good with my mill)

 

[DAVe3283]

I haven't replaced head gaskets, but I installed head studs and injectors. From my experience, everything Mackin said is spot on.

I also removed the rockers as a unit without removing lash. Just loosen it in stages so you don't risk bending it. I put it on the same way (stages), and measured all the lashes and it was still in spec. However, you will most likely need to adjust the valves with new gaskets, especially if the heads have to be planed.

And do reuse the injector cups that are in good shape, but if you feel iffy about one, replace it. When I did injectors I only resealed the 1 cup that came out with the injector, but I recommend resealing all of them since the heads are off anyway.

Take your time! There is nothing worse than trying to rush, because you end up torquing the valve covers down only to discover the injector return lines sitting on the workbench. When that happens, you are slower than if you'd just taken your time in the first place. ...ahem...

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

 

[adeso]

http://www.duramaxdiesels.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=138

Herry did post this in the other thread, but here is some links to the GM tech manual. If you need more I have it on my computer and can take screen shots. Be sure to read it a few times before you tear into it, and if you follow it should work out well for you

 

[fishv12]

All I have to say is thanks to all of you who are helping me I am very grateful and would invite you all to my house for beers and steak I have to say that you guys know your stuff!

I was thinking about ordering everything I needed in one bundle from a sponsor or good source. I know of one but I don't want to throw names in the thread as they might not be sponsors. Anyone want to PM me with recommendations

Last night I was watching a couple vids on adjusting lash it's actually easy. I also found this link for duramax engines. It can eventually help others too! http://merchant-automotive.com/tech/valveadjustment.pdf. I will do exactly what you said Dave3283 to remove mine out. Although it's the new valve gaskets that I am now going to research. What is the procedure to check and if need be change these, etc. I suppose that would be in the tech manual too Adeso posted.

Here another link that might help out with LB7 fuel lines rust : http://merchant-automotive.com/tech/lb7line.pdf.

As far as head gaskets just go with JoshH said and get grade C. All in agreement This will just mean I can start ordering parts ahead of time. Not that it matters much I guess since there is going to be a little down time while I get my heads checked/milled, etc.

 

[fishv12]

Adeso:
Thanks! For offering to help with my heads I truly appreciate it Like I said I will have a good look around town first but I truly appreciate the fact that you will bring them to your known shop to get them milled if they need it .

As for the programmer or EFI live I don't really know anyone with one around. I have an OBDII "checker" with live data but that's about as far as it goes. I figure if I do this I might just as well send these injectors to get checked and balanced if they need be. I really don't feel like doing this whole thing anytime soon again lol!

I will review the whole manual in details I didn't see the link in the first place.

 

[fishv12]

On another note I haven't had any luck finding a beater yet. The car my friend's brother had which was bought from an auction ended up having major problems and is going back to the auction. Now his brother is going to pick me up another beater today... Not sure what it's going to be! Excitement Maybe I am being a little sarcastic right now because I already miss my truck . The Epica was quite nice tho with leather seat and a sunroof. Oh well I probably will end up driving an old beat up police car haha! I will have ppl slowing down around me all the time.

 

[adeso]

Adeso:
Thanks! For offering to help with my heads I truly appreciate it Like I said I will have a good look around town first but I truly appreciate the fact that you will bring them to your known shop to get them milled if they need it .

As for the programmer or EFI live I don't really know anyone with one around. I have an OBDII "checker" with live data but that's about as far as it goes. I figure if I do this I might just as well send these injectors to get checked and balanced if they need be. I really don't feel like doing this whole thing anytime soon again lol!

I will review the whole manual in details I didn't see the link in the first place.

I'm sure there is a shop close to you that can do it, if not there are a few members on here that do own shops that can do it, last case I can give you a name of the shop that did my machine work for me. The book says to back the lash off before you remove the rockers, some guys don't but you have to be very careful not to bend that part (it is easy to do). It would be much cheaper to find someone that can read the rates of the injectors vs pulling them off and sending them off (it cost a lot to do that)

 

[fishv12]

Adeso:
Good afternoon my friend

For backing the lash off the rockers I suppose it seems so simple I may as well! Why take a risk with something that I need to adjust afterwards anyways. I don't see that taking me much time at all.

For the heads bro if I can't find a shop in town, which I am certain I will but if I can't, I'll just send them to you and you can check them and get them looked after if they are crooked. Unless you think that is too much trouble I don't want to impose but for some reason I trust you Either way the heads are still in and my truck is sitting in the driveway ever since the coolant issue.

For the injectors well I suppose I can try to grab myself a used programmer off Ebay maybe. Heck I could also use it to boost my truck a little and maybe hopefully reprogram it for my new tire size. Any idea which one I could use to do that with? I would need a little help to know what to look for so I can determine if the injectors are still in good shape.

 

[adeso]

If you are going to do a bunch of work on your truck EFI live is the way to go. you can contact one of the vendors, or I used Idaho Rob's stuff (he is not a vendor on here). EFI lets you track down a bunch of problems you could have, only thing better is a tech II and they cost 4 times as much. If you are willing to take on a HG job, and plan on keeping the truck, I would get EFI just for the ease of tracking down stuff in the future.
I think most of the other guy on here would agree with this.

 

[fishv12]

Deep down I am just wanting to fix my truck back to stock as boring as it sounds I am not looking to make my truck anything else than it already is It would be nice to correct tire size and maybe give it a little extra go maybe but I care little about that. So tell me what exact version or tool of EFI live I would need to check the injectors because I quickly looked and I am totally confused by all the different versions.

Back when I have my Stealth I had a datalogger which was basically a palm book plugged into the car OBDII port which would log pretty much everything. I also had an SAFC... So it's not like I am a complete noob with this sort of stuff it's just that I am no longer looking to play with these toys much. I suppose you could say that I lost interest in modding.

 

[fishv12]

Good day all!

I have found a vehicule for the interim. I actually lucked out and got myself a pretty nice and clean 2003 Tribute although with a little issue. Idles a little too high but I already have some parts on order to try and fix it. At least now I am not on foot! I do need a vehicule to go to work and all.

On another note now I want to clean my garage! My work bench is full of stuff and there is stuff everywhere. My grandfather passed away recently and well I inherited his tools which well simply got piled on my work bench until I start organizing. Once I am done with the organizing and prepping everything for the winter months then the truck is going to find residence in the garage to get worked on.

Thanks for all the help fellas!

 

[fishv12]

On a side note I would still like to know the exact version and model of EFI live that I would require to check my injectors. I honestly looked and it's pretty confusing this stuff! I would be interested in pre-programmed tunes if it is possible but all depending on the price.

Thanks for the help!