Is anyone out there running one of these kits?? if so how does it run? Mpg? Power? just havent heard much on these in a while
Empire Diesel Superchager kit
- Thread starter Builtlngbd
- Start date
Not sure if it's that or the claims with not much to back it up.
I'll stop while I can.
I'm still waiting after a couple of years of messing with them to prove my combinations worthiness.
Crap, there I go, I said I would stop.
I'll stop while I can.
I'm still waiting after a couple of years of messing with them to prove my combinations worthiness.
Crap, there I go, I said I would stop.
Must be missing something. I'm new on here but been on diesel place and dmaxforum for a while. Looks like you have a centri/turbo setup. How do you like it? Me and Jarrett truly want to know haha.
Is anyone out there running one of these kits?? if so how does it run? Mpg? Power? just havent heard much on these in a while
These kits were never officially released... i assume lack of interest and or results were not what everyone expected. I am sure however if you contacted them for a custom one off kit they could help you out but with prices in the 6,000$ range i can't see it being worth it. Mike and Mick have had some amazing results but those 2 guys are extremely smart and have tried countless combination's. Facts are it is cheaper in the long run to run a nice big set of twins versus a straight custom setup that requires more than a bolt off bolt on job. Maybe Mike can help you out as well:thumb:
I certainly like my custom one off kit, the custom 12" 10 rib pulley cost $650, rebuilt procharger $1200, 3/4" thick aluminum bracket (I made myself) $35 from the scrap yard, pulleys, idlers, pipe, etc. lets say $1,000 at the most. I'd say its doable on the cheap but then again I would rather make my own twin turbo kit than spend the outrageous prices for complete kits.
I dont have any track times for mine but hope to later this summer after the solid axle and 4 link go in. I will say I like it better than my old set of twins.
I dont have any track times for mine but hope to later this summer after the solid axle and 4 link go in. I will say I like it better than my old set of twins.
This is the supercharger kit you were talking about a while back for your 4 cylinder isuzu conversion right. If so, I've been wondering how it's been going.
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Yes the very same (my avatar is the old pic of the twins) I have to swap the IRS for the solid axle and 4 link as soon as I finish the wifes 01 jeep diesel conversion, should be done within 2 days of me getting back home from this buisness trip.
(my avatar is the old pic of the twins) I have to swap the IRS for the solid axle and 4 link as soon as I finish the wifes 01 jeep diesel conversion, should be done within 2 days of me getting back home from this buisness trip.
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Kits are realeased and available for purchase. We have many customers out there running them. Just cuz there not on here dont mean that they dont work. Kit prices start out in the $5500 Range. Keep in mind what you are all getting with the kit.
ATI Damper $450
Crank Pin Kit $200
Battery Relocation Kit $120
Complete EGR and Air Intake heater Delete Kit $150
New Polished Coolant Tank $150
Electric Fans $120
So yeah if you wanted to save some money these items can be deleted from the kit and then you are right at the same $$ as competing compound turbo kits.
Do you see MPG gains on big twin turbo kits?
Do you see drive pressure numbers lower then boost numbers?
Can you make 600hp with out headstuds drive every day hook up to 20K lbs and tow a trailer and have EGTS never Exceed 1000deg. at 70mph?
Google it once you might be surprised how many kits are out there.
ATI Damper $450
Crank Pin Kit $200
Battery Relocation Kit $120
Complete EGR and Air Intake heater Delete Kit $150
New Polished Coolant Tank $150
Electric Fans $120
So yeah if you wanted to save some money these items can be deleted from the kit and then you are right at the same $$ as competing compound turbo kits.
Do you see MPG gains on big twin turbo kits?
Do you see drive pressure numbers lower then boost numbers?
Can you make 600hp with out headstuds drive every day hook up to 20K lbs and tow a trailer and have EGTS never Exceed 1000deg. at 70mph?
Google it once you might be surprised how many kits are out there.
Cool so what else is in the kit and what supercharger?
600HP and drive everyday without a supercharger? Yes, single charger and no head studs for sure. Not sure that is a supercharger selling point.
600HP and drive everyday without a supercharger? Yes, single charger and no head studs for sure. Not sure that is a supercharger selling point.
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EDP thanks for the response. I know this is Builtlngbd's post but i was sitting next to him when he wrote it haha. Builtlngbd was really asking for me since he already has the MPI twins. I'm interested in the kit for pure fuel economy and light towing. Doing good right now for an LMM but wanting to build the truck for highway driving not drag racing. Seems kinda dumb to spend thousands to get a few extra MPG's i know but that's my thing. Any additional info would be much appreciated.
Jordan
Jordan
Just drove from our shop to a friends shop in laramie wyoming what once took 3 tanks of fuel one way, Same truck same wheels and tires same load, just added the procahrger kit to it now did it in 2 tanks. I would venture to say that right there is quite a bit of info for MPG. Going over mountain passes never once seen excessive smoke or EGTS get over 850deg. running 80-85mph.
Just heard from a customer that they just did 800hp and 15?? FT. lbs. with the F1R and GT42 setup. Had a hard time keeping the truck on the rollers due to excessive throttle response and only got the truck up to 60-70% throttle. Numerous Pulls and pretty consistent on the dyno numbers :thumb: This same setup can be put on a truck and tow or do whatever you want to do with it!!!
Just heard from a customer that they just did 800hp and 15?? FT. lbs. with the F1R and GT42 setup. Had a hard time keeping the truck on the rollers due to excessive throttle response and only got the truck up to 60-70% throttle. Numerous Pulls and pretty consistent on the dyno numbers :thumb: This same setup can be put on a truck and tow or do whatever you want to do with it!!!
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I don't know if Chad is talking about the guys from Harley diesel in Ga but I saw their truck this weekend with the procharger and gt 42 setup on the pulling track and it was bad ass. Truck had zero lag and hooked the sled and went. No spooling or anything. Had a wicked sound at idle and going down the track. Truck pulled very well.
1728 miles with 3 fill-ups and 36 gallons each fill-up would be 16 miles to the gallon. Same mileage and two fill-ups would be 24mpg. That's a huge increase by simply adding a supercharger and I'd definitely want to know more. Of course without specific numbers I have to guess.
While I really like driving superchargers and try my best to see the practical side of doing so, I only wish I had such long term great success with my arrangements. The power is unbelievable but, twins have incredible power potentials and are proven as well. EGT's, yes have been low and great but lowering EGT numbers have proven to come a cost of boost pressure increases which have ultimately lowered mpg. A VVT has been tuned to decrease EGT's under normal conditions as well. Have a friend/customer who pulls truck and trailer weighing 30000+lbs and EGT's never exceed 1200f stock vvt lly. My biggest issue so far, as I've configured, is cooling. Removing the factory fan to accommodate a belt driven charger limits my avocation of supercharging. On the track and too a point pulling or just unloaded cruising might be fine but, engine coolant temperature soar from not enough air passing over the radiator even with the best cooling fans. Very easy to reach limits faster than by simply Compounding turbos and leaving the mechanical fan.
I have to see more to believe more. I can surely take the beating for not building right and for not sizing right and more, not knowing what I'm doing. Tell us more about the 800 hp. Was it a stock build? 800 with a supercharger and stock injectors is not new. Low EGT's on the stocker all day long and no smoke, but came a cost of eventually windowing two stock engines. After running Vortech, Paxton and Procharger I just don't think there is a magic charger. Biggest lesson was proven, a supercharger is more limited than a turbocharger in the compressor map area. A supercharger has a smaller rpm / cfm range than a turbocharger. Surges way faster and choke is another story.
While I really like driving superchargers and try my best to see the practical side of doing so, I only wish I had such long term great success with my arrangements. The power is unbelievable but, twins have incredible power potentials and are proven as well. EGT's, yes have been low and great but lowering EGT numbers have proven to come a cost of boost pressure increases which have ultimately lowered mpg. A VVT has been tuned to decrease EGT's under normal conditions as well. Have a friend/customer who pulls truck and trailer weighing 30000+lbs and EGT's never exceed 1200f stock vvt lly. My biggest issue so far, as I've configured, is cooling. Removing the factory fan to accommodate a belt driven charger limits my avocation of supercharging. On the track and too a point pulling or just unloaded cruising might be fine but, engine coolant temperature soar from not enough air passing over the radiator even with the best cooling fans. Very easy to reach limits faster than by simply Compounding turbos and leaving the mechanical fan.
I have to see more to believe more. I can surely take the beating for not building right and for not sizing right and more, not knowing what I'm doing. Tell us more about the 800 hp. Was it a stock build? 800 with a supercharger and stock injectors is not new. Low EGT's on the stocker all day long and no smoke, but came a cost of eventually windowing two stock engines. After running Vortech, Paxton and Procharger I just don't think there is a magic charger. Biggest lesson was proven, a supercharger is more limited than a turbocharger in the compressor map area. A supercharger has a smaller rpm / cfm range than a turbocharger. Surges way faster and choke is another story.
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I'm hoping one day to see some dyno sheets with torque curves. I'm not near as knowledgable as most everyone on here but i would think more torque lower in rpms would boost mpgs because that's where most fuel is burnt getting up to speed. Think it would also help with towing/sled pulling. And mike i'm confused on your cooling issue. Can't you just run electric fans? Or do they not move enough air? I've read on dmaxforum before that the ford taurus fans move enough but flexalite fans don't. Just curious
The best way to boost torque down low is increase VE with the least amount of fuel to do so. The best way of course is to decrease any restrictions for air to the cylinders by way of filter, piping, head work and cam. Also you have pumping air to the cylinders by way of charging. If the supercharger or turbocharger is in it's best map range, ie least amount of heat generated and transferred to the charge, best mileage will be obtained. Frankly, more air doesn't mean better mileage, it's a balance. Getting the most out of what ever you choose while staying simple and efficient is where it's at. Compounding affords this so long as efficiency is in check.
As far as cooling: The Taurus fans work great for mildly modified engines when trying to regain hp/torque from the factory fan. When dealing with stock hp ( BTU and eventually heat rejection ) or mild increases to hp, these fans can only do so much work. If the manual fan is requiring say 25hp to move x amount of air, it's hard to increase efficiency by electric fan to 4 or 5 or more hundred percent. 25hp is 25 * 748 watts or 18,750 watts to drive an equal fan. That is 12 volts and 1500+amps. So, those little Taurus fans can only really move about 40amps each at best or 960 watts between the two. That's just over 1.25 hp between the two. Now when you install the supercharger, do you really have room for those two Taurus fans and are they going to move enough air to dissipate the heat from the added btu rejected in the cooling system from added fuel. The Supercharger requires torque and ultimately fuel to drive. I have a Vortech V4 z trim which requires 100hp to operate at 120lbs/min air and 6psiq and the same hp at 50lbs/min and 20psig boost. With those figures, you can see moving air and building boost require torque and ultimately hp ( ie.. fuel ). Turbocharging is not free by any means and requires fuel to drive. However, heat conversion and keeping drive pressure as low as possible afford the turbocharger greater room for efficiency. When exhaust pressure ratio and intake restriction increase, the turbocharger seems to really drop in efficiency drastically. I do not have the tools to prove every point or disprove, either way. However, observation, trial and error and driving seem to coincide. Again, I'm not knocking the supercharger, just trying to be realistic.
As far as cooling: The Taurus fans work great for mildly modified engines when trying to regain hp/torque from the factory fan. When dealing with stock hp ( BTU and eventually heat rejection ) or mild increases to hp, these fans can only do so much work. If the manual fan is requiring say 25hp to move x amount of air, it's hard to increase efficiency by electric fan to 4 or 5 or more hundred percent. 25hp is 25 * 748 watts or 18,750 watts to drive an equal fan. That is 12 volts and 1500+amps. So, those little Taurus fans can only really move about 40amps each at best or 960 watts between the two. That's just over 1.25 hp between the two. Now when you install the supercharger, do you really have room for those two Taurus fans and are they going to move enough air to dissipate the heat from the added btu rejected in the cooling system from added fuel. The Supercharger requires torque and ultimately fuel to drive. I have a Vortech V4 z trim which requires 100hp to operate at 120lbs/min air and 6psiq and the same hp at 50lbs/min and 20psig boost. With those figures, you can see moving air and building boost require torque and ultimately hp ( ie.. fuel ). Turbocharging is not free by any means and requires fuel to drive. However, heat conversion and keeping drive pressure as low as possible afford the turbocharger greater room for efficiency. When exhaust pressure ratio and intake restriction increase, the turbocharger seems to really drop in efficiency drastically. I do not have the tools to prove every point or disprove, either way. However, observation, trial and error and driving seem to coincide. Again, I'm not knocking the supercharger, just trying to be realistic.
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