Info: TCM tuning

[ZeroGravity58]

I just want to start off saying im not here to bad mouth anyone. I just want to throw this out there regarding TCM tuning. I was running a TCM tune that i was sent. Only thing i ever changed on it was the shift points. I never paid much thought to the tune. Well after 6,000 miles on my stage IV I burnt up the C2's, had some heat in the C3's but i did some other damage also. The conclusion was that there was a tie up in some of the shifts due to the tuning. Like i said not bad mouthing anyone just wanted to give everyone a heads up not to make the same mistake. Im putting the stock TCM tune back in mine with my changed shift points.

 

[paint94979]

I just want to start off saying im not here to bad mouth anyone. I just want to throw this out there regarding TCM tuning. I was running a TCM tune that i was sent. Only thing i ever changed on it was the shift points. I never paid much thought to the tune. Well after 6,000 miles on my stage IV I burnt up the C2's, had some heat in the C3's but i did some other damage also. The conclusion was that there was a tie up in some of the shifts due to the tuning. Like i said not bad mouthing anyone just wanted to give everyone a heads up not to make the same mistake. Im putting the stock TCM tune back in mine with my changed shift points.

I was always under the impression you can't just raise shift points and be done with it... did you adjust the shift mph as well? What about modifying the ECM tune to allow the truck to defuel at the proper RPM?

 

[ZeroGravity58]

I was always under the impression you can't just raise shift points and be done with it... did you adjust the shift mph as well? What about modifying the ECM tune to allow the truck to defuel at the proper RPM?

Yes i raised the RPM and the MPH but thats not what caused the problem. The problem is thought to be the torque managment tables in the TCM/ECM. Some change the ECM but leave the TCM stock, Some change both. Mine was tieing up shifts. I just wanted to throw it out there to warn everyone. The repairs arent going to be cheap for me because of it.

 

[[email protected]]

Can the shift timing not be increased because the release times are limited mechanically? Are they completely controled mechanically or is pressure slowly released while something mechanical (like a spring) is pushing back?
So pressure controls the how fast the release is up to the point where the mechanical pressure cannot release fast enough?

I am using the tow/haul shift timing as my regular timing and it feels a lot better especially at part throttle it shifts a lot smoother. I figured it can't hurt anything becuase they programed it to shift like this in tow/haul?

 

[[email protected]]

Will the allison throw codes if tie ups happen or is it useless now becuase of the added power and tuning?

 

[ZeroGravity58]

Im not sure im not some one with more knowledge will have to answer that.

 

[TrentNell]

Can the shift timing not be increased because the release times are limited mechanically? Are they completely controled mechanically or is pressure slowly released while something mechanical (like a spring) is pushing back?
So pressure controls the how fast the release is up to the point where the mechanical pressure cannot release fast enough?

I am using the tow/haul shift timing as my regular timing and it feels a lot better especially at part throttle it shifts a lot smoother. I figured it can't hurt anything becuase they programed it to shift like this in tow/haul?

in would steer clear of playing with shift timing other than what you have done so far , the changes that are being discused are mostly about defuel and that is mostly done in the ecm . unless i am off thats my assumption .

sorry to hear about your failure Zero

 

[GMC_2002_Dmax]

Was this a TCM tune that had the defuel request disabled ???



Sucks that you had a trans tore up over it.

In my opinion this is some good advice for anyone who gets a tune from another efi live user and is unsure about the tune file.

1) As a rule disabling the request for defuel is the fastest way to ruin a built transmission, Tables D5196 AND D5197 should be left alone especially D5196 !!! I know a few tuners like to run with that disabled, big NO-NO !!!

2) A really hard shift that is delayed is a sign of a tie-up, the shifts should be firm and crisp, not delayed and really harsh.

3) Leaving some defuel in is the safest way to go, especially when pushing big power.

Good Luck,

Dipper will make it like new again !!

 

[TrentNell]

Was this a TCM tune that had the defuel request disabled ???



Sucks that you had a trans tore up over it.

In my opinion this is some good advice for anyone who gets a tune from another efi live user and is unsure about the tune file.

1) As a rule disabling the request for defuel is the fastest way to ruin a built transmission, Tables D5196 AND D5197 should be left alone especially D5196 !!! I know a few tuners like to run with that disabled, big NO-NO !!!

2) A really hard shift that is delayed is a sign of a tie-up, the shifts should be firm and crisp, not delayed and really harsh.

3) Leaving some defuel in is the safest way to go, especially when pushing big power.

Good Luck,

Dipper will make it like new again !!

Def as Tony stated stay away from defueling shifts unless you really know what your doing and def should be done with propper fueling tables , and not in the TCM side as some do . ( not saying this was the case Zero )

 

[03 D-max]

so who has good tranny tunes?

 

[Cougar281]

I was always under the impression you can't just raise shift points and be done with it... did you adjust the shift mph as well? What about modifying the ECM tune to allow the truck to defuel at the proper RPM?

I'm hardly an expert tuner, but I think the TCM looks at RPM and MPH to determine shifts, meaning it has to meet both contitions in order to shift, so if you raise the RPM for WOT up to say 3700, it should command the shift there becasue while it had already met the MPH requirement, it did not meet the RPM requirement until where you placed it. I also don't think you need to adjust any defuel, as it should base that on tq, not RPM.

 

[Mike L.]

So called tranny tunes are nothing more than an idiot f-----g with something he knows nothing about. Play with trans tunes and you will lose a 1,000.00 planet plus labor and clutches. Shift quality is adjusted and tuned at the ECM, not the TCM.
Why do I get the feeling this might be a pink slippers tune?

 

[ZeroGravity58]

Was this a TCM tune that had the defuel request disabled ???



Sucks that you had a trans tore up over it.

In my opinion this is some good advice for anyone who gets a tune from another efi live user and is unsure about the tune file.

1) As a rule disabling the request for defuel is the fastest way to ruin a built transmission, Tables D5196 AND D5197 should be left alone especially D5196 !!! I know a few tuners like to run with that disabled, big NO-NO !!!

2) A really hard shift that is delayed is a sign of a tie-up, the shifts should be firm and crisp, not delayed and really harsh.

3) Leaving some defuel in is the safest way to go, especially when pushing big power.

Good Luck,

Dipper will make it like new again !!

You nailed it on the head. I wont say who i got the tune from but it is a well know person. Table D5196 has been modified pretty heavily and D5197 was changed in the TCM. I never paid any mind to the TCM torque tables until i started having problems and Seems as if everyone changes the ECM torque tables so i never paid any mind to them either. I never really did notice really harsh shifting. Anyways Im putting these tables back to stock. I just wanted to warn everyone. Look at these tables first and dont change them.

 

[03 D-max]

so what about the torque management tables in the ecm are they alright to mess with? I need to get ride of some defueling and when i adjust the managment tables my shifts get very hard

 

[ZeroGravity58]

So called tranny tunes are nothing more than an idiot f-----g with something he knows nothing about. Play with trans tunes and you will lose a 1,000.00 planet plus labor and clutches. Shift quality is adjusted and tuned at the ECM, not the TCM.
Why do I get the feeling this might be a pink slippers tune?

Mike i got the tunes as a package deal so i never paid any mind to them. When you pay for something you expect it to be right. You got it besides the clutches i hurt the planet.

 

[Mike L.]

Mike i got the tunes as a package deal so i never paid any mind to them. When you pay for something you expect it to be right. You got it besides the clutches i hurt the planet.

I am sorry this happened. Problem is; this idiot is not done screwing people yet.

 

[Mike L.]

Listen up people.
Every Alli is different. Trim solenoids fire differently from trans to trans. Tranmissions are built differently with their clutch clearance and valve body valves reacting to comands. Some are a little quicker than others. Electrical comands may be slightly different from truck to truck.Driving habits are different from person to person. A weaker battery will slow down the PSM signal to a trim solenoid. Some wire harnesses will have higher resistance than others and the proper signal may get there sooner or later than normal. Tire sizes are different and that throws signals off. Fueling the engine has a lot to do with shift quality and so does boost. With all that said; just how in the hell do you think you are going to improve your trans shifting?
Play the game defensivley. I build my Alli's knowing some idiot is going to mess with the trans without knowing anything about how it works. More Alli's are destroyed by ECM tunes than TCM.
Seems everyone is a master tuner now. Be carefull who's tunes you use. If not, keep the credit card handy.

 

[THEFERMANATOR]

More Alli's are destroyed by ECM tunes than TCM.

I thought it was the other way around? I don't claim to be a tuner, nor do I ever want to be. Just making sure I understand you correctly.

 

[GMC_2002_Dmax]

Just an FYI,

Dipper pulled my '02 trans out after almost 90K for a TC swap and I had him go thru C1-C3's.

All looked good. C3's were replaced because of some minor hot spots, he would have left them in but we changed them anyway.

I run a stock 2001 TCM, its free for whoever wants it.

I don't screw with much in it except for rpm shifts at WOT for my pulling customers and the bigger twinned trucks.

The shifting is all done in the ecm with the base tq and torque limited injection quantity tables, provided the main fueling and throttle tables are also correctly done,

 

[duratothemax]

So called tranny tunes are nothing more than an idiot f-----g with something he knows nothing about. Play with trans tunes and you will lose a 1,000.00 planet plus labor and clutches. Shift quality is adjusted and tuned at the ECM, not the TCM.
Why do I get the feeling this might be a pink slippers tune?

I agree

x2!!!!