Man made climate change

Dozerboy

Well-known member
Jun 23, 2009
4,892
470
83
TX of course
We all think its bad now just wait it the EPA get hold of ALL waterways.

Peope is Socal think all these laws are so great until the wildfires start up. Then those open space laws ain't so great...
 

jacobdewey

This won't last long...
Jan 14, 2011
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While raising production levels is great, there are downfalls to that benefit...right?
Coming full circle here on things I'm fascinated by, I've seen research that supports the "theory" that GMO crops tend to leave the soil in a poorer state and sooner than a traditional crop of plant organisms, and that while GMO's do grow faster , are resiliant to pesticide and produce more yeild, that those attributes also cause the plant to take in less stored nutrient, and thus also provide less nutrient to the consumer...
What are your thoughts here, true/false
???

I grow my own beef, several of my own vegtables, and of course potatoes. I also have a private well, so some of the theories don't directly apply to me.

This will be a long one!

We learned a long time ago that crop rotation is key for plant health, yeild, and soil nutrient preservation. Using conventional synthetic fertilizer adds large amounts of sodium to your soil, which is a death sentence to your plants, soil and water uptake. With a large percent of farms moving from manual to mechanized irrigation, it started causing issues. In order to control sodium levels, you need to be able to push the sodium through the soil with water. Mechanized irrigation puts down less water, more often, causing a "wicking" effect to take place. This "wicks" all the sodium, along with other minerals to the top few feet of soil, hurting plants, tying up nutrients, and causing soil erosion, all of which has a compounding effect on the other!

With rotation, and proper irrigation, we've been able to see a huge jump in available soil nutrition, soil texture and a sodium level that was 20 times lower than what it was when we took over certain fields. We started by doing a no till rotation. A no till or minimum till operation will keep more organic matter in your soil. That helps with water uptake and soil nutrition. It allowed us to run our mechanized irrigation slower, less often, and helped us push our sodium out of the growing "layer". This in turn helped more plants grow and that is where the GMO comes in. We used to have to use several herbicides to keep the weeds controlled in any given year. These harsh chemicals would put our plants through what we called "chemo therapy". The plants would suffer some of the effects of the chemicals used to treat weeds, and therefore did a poor job of being able to make a decent canopy if the herbicides didn't kill off a resistant plant. In comes roundup ready. I can keep my plants healthier since they are resistant to the chemical we use to control the other weeds. It gets better. Now we can grow a thick canopy of plants, that control ground cover to keep unwanted weeds from getting sunlight and growing. In crops like alfalfa, it has made it to the point where we spray many fields once every other year, which saves money, and herbicides! On top of that our yield is significantly better since we don't have to use "chemo therapy" causing chemicals on it, stunting its growth, which is now a compounding good thing of soil nutrition and yields!

It still comes down to good farming practices, but everything we learn to do helps!

Being able to grow the same amount of crop on 20% less land is an awesome thing to think about when you bring up the population problems we are facing! GMO's are the key to feeding an ever increasing population on an ever decreasing amount of land. Without GMO's we would be starving to death.



Hmmm
Do you see an "agenda" there
Take the old guy that was trickling info to the public out, and replace him with an attractive woman...

:roflmao:

I agree to a point, anymore though, it would seem like even the good ones are forced to make decisions against their own better judgment once they are in their respective position of power...it's more a game of thrones than a democracy

In which our only ally is hope

I asked my state senator how he compromises when the matter is against what he believes, yet the majority of the population wins over that belief.

He told me that "you never compromise on your morals, but everything else can be up for debate". I felt like that was a decent answer for a politician. lol

Here are some man made climate manipulation facts, again on a localized scale. http://www.uwyo.edu/uw/news/2014/04...ng-cloud-seeding-statistical-information.html
 
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DMAXchris

It’s only temporary!
Apr 28, 2009
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Natrona Heights PA
I REFUSE to eat anything grown with Round-up Ready seeds. I try my hardest to avoid Monsantos garbage in my life. The phytotoxins in the plants from being soaked in weed killer is then ingested by your family and children. And then everyone wonders why the kids these days have so many problems. Its because of the chemicals in the food and water.

Jacob you are so wrong on the GMO thing. Do some research instead of believing your seed salesman. Organic farming produces higher yields and better crops. Get off of Monsantos tit and figure out how to farm the correct way like our ancestors did. I'm not OK with garbage GMO crops killing the bees and polluting the soil. I will do everything in my power to boycott farms producing GMO crops or feed their beef/chickens any type of GMO corn. Grass-fed, free range, organic is all I purchase.
 
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jacobdewey

This won't last long...
Jan 14, 2011
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I REFUSE to eat anything grown with Round-up Ready seeds. I try my hardest to avoid Monsantos garbage in my life. The phytotoxins in the plants from being soaked in weed killer is then ingested by your family and children. And then everyone wonders why the kids these days have so many problems. Its because of the chemicals in the food and water.

Jacob you are so wrong on the GMO thing. Do some research instead of believing your seed salesman. Organic farming produces higher yields and better crops. Get off of Monsantos tit and figure out how to farm the correct way like our ancestors did. I'm not OK with garbage GMO crops killing the bees and polluting the soil. I will do everything in my power to boycott farms producing GMO crops or feed their beef/chickens any type of GMO corn. Grass-fed, free range, organic is all I purchase.

This is all off our own experience chris. Whether you like it or not, even "organic" farms aren't really organic. Our family has been farmers for as long as we have traced back our history. There are several organic farms around us that have all gone broke or went back to conventional farming practices. I don't know where your information comes from, but mine comes from generations of experience. I eat gmo's, I drink milk from cows treated with rsbt, and have several hundred healthy bee hives on our RR alfalfa crops. It's a crock. Processed food is where the problem is. Bee's have been being killed by a chemical in new pesticides being used around the globe, not because of gmo's. If you get a chance, give these articles a read.

http://www.techtimes.com/articles/6...ed-colony-collapse-disorder-harvard-study.htm

http://blogs.scientificamerican.com...101-organic-farming-conventional-agriculture/
 
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plowboy_lbz

Farmer
Aug 6, 2013
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I REFUSE to eat anything grown with Round-up Ready seeds. I try my hardest to avoid Monsantos garbage in my life. The phytotoxins in the plants from being soaked in weed killer is then ingested by your family and children. And then everyone wonders why the kids these days have so many problems. Its because of the chemicals in the food and water.

Jacob you are so wrong on the GMO thing. Do some research instead of believing your seed salesman. Organic farming produces higher yields and better crops. Get off of Monsantos tit and figure out how to farm the correct way like our ancestors did. I'm not OK with garbage GMO crops killing the bees and polluting the soil. I will do everything in my power to boycott farms producing GMO crops or feed their beef/chickens any type of GMO corn. Grass-fed, free range, organic is all I purchase.


Lol stay in the city and we'll do the farming. People have diseases from all the smog and polutants in the cities, plus with 7 billon people on earth your going to have more diseases and mutations. You can drink roundup and it won't harm you no matter what you read Organic farms do not nor ever will produce higher yields. Like op said organic farms aren't organic because for a plant to take in nitrogen it has to be in an inorganic form. Little food for thought.
 

plowboy_lbz

Farmer
Aug 6, 2013
431
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This is all off our own experience chris. Whether you like it or not, even "organic" farms aren't really organic. Our family has been farmers for as long as we have traced back our history. There are several organic farms around us that have all gone broke or went back to conventional farming practices. I don't know where your information comes from, but mine comes from generations of experience. I eat gmo's, I drink milk from cows treated with rsbt, and have several hundred healthy bee hives on our RR alfalfa crops. It's a crock. Processed food is where the problem is. Bee's have been being killed by a chemical in new pesticides being used around the globe, not because of gmo's.

http://www.techtimes.com/articles/6...ed-colony-collapse-disorder-harvard-study.htm

Experience is worth more than anything you read on the Internet, see on the news, or hear from friends all put together.

I will continue to eat my "tainted" beef and corn that will make me grow a 3rd arm. People who don't like that can starve, one less mouth to feed. Organic is a fad, and a way for big business to charge twice as much for the same product. Give it a few years and everyone will have forgotten about it.
 

S Phinney

Active member
Aug 15, 2008
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Quncy, Fl
I fit into #1. Haha. I'm not into conspiracy theories, and I believe alot of things people might think are crazy. (I'm a mormon.) But.... I like to make my own decisions based on information that I've gathered. When it comes to politics and economic factors, I would rather run off facts than faith. Science is meant to be able to produce reproductable results to reach a conclusion. At this point global warming is in the middle of the scientific method. They are stuck on hypothesis, and people take these scientific suggestions as fact. It's not fact as they have no way to include all variables that would be needed in these experiments. This is something that 100% of those scientists will agree with. In every article I've read citing the case for man made climate change, "suggests, mostly certain", and "other unknown variables" always seem to appear in the text.

I want to breathe clean air and drink clean water as bad as the next guy, but we need a balance. Go ahead and regulate farmers out of business. No food or clothing. Go ahead and regulate loggers out of the forest. No shelter. Go ahead and regulate miners and drillers out of business. No energy, no materials to make anything. All of the sudden there are no other jobs. There's nothing. At the very least, the already over stringent regulations are pushing all these these costs skyward. These are the jobs being hit hardest by EPA over stepping, and by no means do I want to do away with the EPA. There are definitely those people who try to cut corners, hurting others and themselves in the process. The fact the EPA controls the water that runs off my roof into a barrel is insane. The climate change argument just gives the EPA more authority to be in each of our personal lives. If that's what you want, so be it, but it will cost you.
That is very well said. Too much government is a bad idea.
 

DMAXchris

It’s only temporary!
Apr 28, 2009
2,273
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Natrona Heights PA
Experience is worth more than anything you read on the Internet, see on the news, or hear from friends all put together.

I will continue to eat my "tainted" beef and corn that will make me grow a 3rd arm. People who don't like that can starve, one less mouth to feed. Organic is a fad, and a way for big business to charge twice as much for the same product. Give it a few years and everyone will have forgotten about it.

I grow my own food with no pesticides and organic fert. If you try and say bat guano is not organic, you're an idiot. I eat local beef that is grass fed. I will not support farmers like you. Have a great holiday!
 

jacobdewey

This won't last long...
Jan 14, 2011
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I grow my own food with no pesticides and organic fert. If you try and say bat guano is not organic, you're an idiot. I eat local beef that is grass fed. I will not support farmers like you. Have a great holiday!

I don't see anything wrong with that at all chris. Self reliance is hard to come by these days, so I applaud you for doing what you need or want to do for yourself and family.

Everyone is entitled to their ideas and opinions, that's what this country was founded on.

Plowboy and myself know what it takes to feed the world, and we will keep doing it. Sorry chris but the long term sustainability of organic farming will not produce enough food for 7 billion people.

Seriously bat guano. .... research Histoplasmosis, and tell me that's a good idea. Use a compost pile or something along those lines for fertility if you are concerned about what you are ingesting.
 

SmokeShow

Well-known member
Nov 30, 2006
6,818
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Lawrenceburg, KY
Where's our buddy duallymax?! He always has great things to add to these discussions. I sure hope he's doing alright. It's been a while since I've seen him post & one of the last times he did he mentioned a new intense chemo treatment.


This has been an interesting discussion guys.
 

DMAXchris

It’s only temporary!
Apr 28, 2009
2,273
2
38
44
Natrona Heights PA
That whole "stay in the city" comment from plowboy rubbed me wrong. I grew up on my Uncles family farm. Feeding chickens, helping herd the cattle, cut fields when I was older, etc. You drive 5 miles from my house and it's all farms.

I don't see anything wrong with that at all chris. Self reliance is hard to come by these days, so I applaud you for doing what you need or want to do for yourself and family.

Everyone is entitled to their ideas and opinions, that's what this country was founded on.

Plowboy and myself know what it takes to feed the world, and we will keep doing it. Sorry chris but the long term sustainability of organic farming will not produce enough food for 7 billion people.

Seriously bat guano. .... research Histoplasmosis, and tell me that's a good idea. Use a compost pile or something along those lines for fertility if you are concerned about what you are ingesting.

Never heard of that with bat guano. I'll look into it. I have compost but I use the shit for a bump in P & K. I know a little about horticulture. I did use mushroom manure on my potatoes last year & it scorched them bad. For daily feeding I use Pure Blend Pro certified OMRI Organic. Stuff looks like molasses. lol.
 

jacobdewey

This won't last long...
Jan 14, 2011
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That whole "stay in the city" comment from plowboy rubbed me wrong. I grew up on my Uncles family farm. Feeding chickens, helping herd the cattle, cut fields when I was older, etc. You drive 5 miles from my house and it's all farms.



Never heard of that with bat guano. I'll look into it. I have compost but I use the shit for a bump in P & K. I know a little about horticulture. I did use mushroom manure on my potatoes last year & it scorched them bad. For daily feeding I use Pure Blend Pro certified OMRI Organic. Stuff looks like molasses. lol.

What needs to happen is try to make a hybrid of organic and conventional farming techniques. Get the best of both worlds! That's what we have been shooting for in our farms. Crop rotation is key for disease control, weed control, water conservation, and soil preservation. Soil is my livelyhood and my children's future. It matters to me, and if you could see our farms and farming practices firsthand you would see how much some farmers care.

I have no problem with you chris and I know you're standing up for what you believe in. That's all plowboy and I are doing too.:hug:

One other thing to remember when using compost is that decomposition will use up most of your nitrogen so you will need to find a way to supplement it. Lightning is a nitrogen fixing process, so just pray for alot of t-storms. Haha. Legumes also have nitrogen fixing nodules naturally, so you could plant them along side something like corn that needs alot of nitrogen.
 
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jacobdewey

This won't last long...
Jan 14, 2011
972
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Where's our buddy duallymax?! He always has great things to add to these discussions. I sure hope he's doing alright. It's been a while since I've seen him post & one of the last times he did he mentioned a new intense chemo treatment.


This has been an interesting discussion guys.

X2 last I heard he was doing well. Hope he's ok!
 

DMAXchris

It’s only temporary!
Apr 28, 2009
2,273
2
38
44
Natrona Heights PA
What needs to happen is try to make a hybrid of organic and conventional farming techniques. Get the best of both worlds! That's what we have been shooting for in our farms. Crop rotation is key for disease control, weed control, water conservation, and soil preservation. Soil is my livelyhood and my children's future. It matters to me, and if you could see our farms and farming practices firsthand you would see how much some farmers care.

I have no problem with you chris and I know you're standing up for what you believe in. That's all plowboy and I are doing too.:hug:

One other thing to remember when using compost is that decomposition will use up most of your nitrogen so you will need to find a way to supplement it. Lightning is a nitrogen fixing process, so just pray for alot of t-storms. Haha. Legumes also have nitrogen fixing nodules naturally, so you could plant them along side something like corn that needs alot of nitrogen.

I missed it last quote, but I totally agree 110% about processed foods.

Staying healthy is my thing. I read a lot of studies and try to avoid anything that can contaminate my body. I don't have a medicine cabinet. Its a supplement cabinet. lol. I'm into how the body works and what effects certain chemicals have on our system. I won't spray Round-Up anywhere near my house, so I have lots of weeds. :DJust a quick article about glyphosate in wheat, even though wheat isn't a GM crop.
http://articles.mercola.com/sites/a...phosate-celiac-disease-connection_facebookdoc

I totally understand the struggle the farmers have. Its your livelihood, and you need to provide for your families, so you do what is necessary. I choose to shop at Whole Foods or local farm markets to support the farmers and watch what goes into my body. I would love to come out west one day and see how a big farming op is run.

And I lied, I used Sevendust 2 years ago on my cucumbers. :( I was sick of those damn beetles, but I only used it before the plants had any flowers.