LBZ: Broke my crank

Bryce418

Still slow
Oct 5, 2009
611
0
0
My point is that there is very little info there. Like I said I have seen zero LLY/LB7 crank failures and about a dozen LBZ/LMM failures in our shop. I do agree power. Has little impact as all of the failures I have seen personally have been stock trucks, although most were heavy medium dutys or tow heavy quite a bit.



I find it quite interesting that I have seen a bunch more failures of one vs the other than the poll shows, that's why I suspect there are more variables that need to be factored in.
 

Burn Down

Hotrodder
Sep 14, 2008
7,092
28
48
Boise Idaho
My point is that there is very little info there. Like I said I have seen zero LLY/LB7 crank failures and about a dozen LBZ/LMM failures in our shop. I do agree power. Has little impact as all of the failures I have seen personally have been stock trucks, although most were heavy medium dutys or tow heavy quite a bit.



I find it quite interesting that I have seen a bunch more failures of one vs the other than the poll shows, that's why I suspect there are more variables that need to be factored in.

Agreed.

I don't work at a GM dealer, all I have is the forums & sometimes you have to read between the lines. That's why I was asking for more info, better pics & broken parts.

I may start thread and offer to pay shipping on crank pieces if they can be cut off. Flat rate boxes aren't bad.
 

Slammed2007Lbz

Super Spicy Tunaz
Feb 1, 2009
1,118
0
36
NE Ohio
I think this is a good idea guys burndown may be able to find something under the microsope that we are unaware of and he may find something that could help solve this issue you never know? It could be just a couple bad apples or he might find some other good intel for us
 

BHoward6.6

West Coast
Feb 9, 2011
274
0
16
Huntington Beach, CA
Great pics.... Finally one that has the fracture surface that isn't wiped completely out, & someone that can take a picture:thumb:

Anywho, the crack starts in the rod journal fillet (bending fatigue maybe some tortional fatigue). The beach marks (fatigue fracture) radiate away from the crack initiation site (like ripples in a pool of water). These are slow growing cracks, very smooth. The rough part brittle, ductile (final fracture) part was just to weak to hold any more. I can't tell from the pics but you should be able to see Ratchet marks in the fillet where the crack began, with the beach marks radiating away. Last pic also shows what looks to be a possible inclusion very close the surface of the rod jouranl fillet, but could be just the lighting.

I have suspected improper grinding of the fillets on the crank. It makes no sense why some live at 1700 hp (Dimitri) and some die at stock power levels... Unless there is a issue with the manfacturing (finishing) of some cranks.

Anyone know if all the cranks are made at the same foundry & finished by the same machine shop?

Bhoward, you want to cut the broken ends off and send them to me? Anyone else that has a broken one that wants, can send it to me as well. Id like to get several of these together and compare... Maybe let some of the Cat guys take a look and help shed some light.


Absolutely, When I pull the rest of the crank, I will pm you for your address and send you the cut off pieces.
 

Maricopaagent

Glamis Anyone?
Oct 10, 2011
257
0
0
Arizona
My point is that there is very little info there. Like I said I have seen zero LLY/LB7 crank failures and about a dozen LBZ/LMM failures in our shop. I do agree power. Has little impact as all of the failures I have seen personally have been stock trucks, although most were heavy medium dutys or tow heavy quite a bit.



I find it quite interesting that I have seen a bunch more failures of one vs the other than the poll shows, that's why I suspect there are more variables that need to be factored in.


Anything to do with Lugging the motor at slower speeds/lower rpm's while under load?
 

Burn Down

Hotrodder
Sep 14, 2008
7,092
28
48
Boise Idaho
Also I'm not claiming to be able crack the code (no pun intended) but Id like give it a shot. I have few avenues that the average guy doesn't have & some training, experience with failure analysis. I have a hunch that it is just a few bad apples out of a ton of good ones. It would be nice to try and chase some answers down with out any ulterior motives clouding the results.
 

Bryce418

Still slow
Oct 5, 2009
611
0
0
It would be nice to try and chase some answers down with out any ulterior motives clouding the results.


No doubt! I unfortunately don't get much chance to do any investigation as I spend most of the time trying to get the customer covered under warranty. Any answers I get from GM are usually clouded in legal bs, like it was on "fire" isn't an acceptable term but experienced a thermal event instead. Which bring the new description, a thermal event with visual indicators!
 

Burn Down

Hotrodder
Sep 14, 2008
7,092
28
48
Boise Idaho
No doubt! I unfortunately don't get much chance to do any investigation as I spend most of the time trying to get the customer covered under warranty. Any answers I get from GM are usually clouded in legal bs, like it was on "fire" isn't an acceptable term but experienced a thermal event instead. Which bring the new description, a thermal event with visual indicators!

Caterpillar likes to do the same. No one wants to admit they blew it...:D
 

juddski88

Freedom Diesel
Jul 1, 2008
4,656
120
63
Chesterfield, Mass.
I Think that Burn Down is on to something for sure. It still confuses me though as to why there were still failures of billet custom cranks in some builds. Maybe they broke in a different way or place...we may never know since pictures don't seem to exist. Maybe the actual issue was always made worse by 1 or 2 other issues like flexing mains and tight bearing clearance. if I can get Dylan to pick up his phone, ill have him send you his lb7 crank for analysis.
 

custom8726

Active member
Feb 25, 2008
2,784
0
36
Upstate N.Y
really? i remember seeing it at todds not long ago...damn

Last time I talked with Todd (6-7 months ago) He closed shop and said he was going to start working from home.. But yes Todd ended up with a bunch of parts from my original build, what he did with them or if he still has them I have no idea..