2nd cp3 insight.

[Maxhdcrew]

I'm beginning to start a build 02 lb7. I have a second cp3 now, running a ppe hot+2. Plan is to go with a 475 over stock nothing radical shooting for 600hp. Question is, would adding a second pump hurt anything with stock injectors, charger ect? I know at higher rpms and at about 60-70 the truck kind of dies out. Pulls real good plenty of power but fades away , I'm assuming it's needing more fuel. I haven't put a lift pump on yet either it may help a bit. I run the 225, tune 5 for the economy and it's really not that smoky at all. On tune 6 it's a blackout, and not a DD tune at all for me. So will adding a second pump to a virtually stock truck be harder on it than it would benefit it ?

 

[quinton]

Sell the Ppe and go with efilive first.

 

[roxyfever]

Need to install a lift pump before even thinking about a second cp3. If your shooting for bigger power i suggest upgrading to efi live. It will run better and be safer then ppe

 

[catman3126]

600 can be made on a single stock pump. going about it wrong man. get custom tuning and ditch the ppe.

 

[Ne-max]

I would just do a exergy sportsman.

 

[Troysalm71]

I ran a ppe tuner before was awesome switched to efi from duramax tuner was a night an day difference an always had bad injector knock with new injectors duramax tuner cleaned that right out.

 

[Maxhdcrew]

Need to install a lift pump before even thinking about a second cp3. If your shooting for bigger power i suggest upgrading to efi live. It will run better and be safer then ppe

Yeah a lift pump is in the works right now, I didn't go with efi because of the lack of knowledge in the tuning department and the hassle it involves getting tunes , changing tunes, and it's just more than I wanna deal with.

 

[Maxhdcrew]

600 can be made on a single stock pump. going about it wrong man. get custom tuning and ditch the ppe.

I've seen a lot of guys making that power on one pump, I figured I have the pump and instead of running one pump all out adding a second pump would relieve some strain on just one and in the long run at only 600 I should have a much more reliable longer lasting set up ?

 

[Maxhdcrew]

I've been down the efi vs ppe vs edge vs Yada Yada. I'm just not looking to go all that crazy and I don't have a need for all that adjustability let alone the knowledge to SAFELY mess with the tuning. Like I stated above more of a hassle than I feel like I'd benefit from. I had a 700hp dodge CR before this truck so I'm kind of familiar with what needs to be done for certain things to work I.E lift pump before ANY other fuel mods ect. When I get to that point ...... I would like to know the answer to my question without just telling me to ditch what I have and change everything. I agree efi is probably better but like everything else it has its place and purpose for certain folks. We all have our favorite way of grilling a steak, as long as it tastes good to the person eating it what's it matter how it's cooked.

 

[aklbz]

Lift pump first, then if you need, go to a stroker CP3. Cheaper then buying an extra CP3 and a dual pump kit.


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[Awenta]

You don't need to tune it yourself....

Just buy an autocal and it works like a canned tuner. Just better.

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[Maxhdcrew]

Lift pump first, then if you need, go to a stroker CP3. Cheaper then buying an extra CP3 and a dual pump kit.


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Most definitely will be putting a lift pump on before I install anything else. With that said I already have another pump. Still the question is would the 2 pumps split the work of one pump added to an other wise stock fuel system with a lift pump? A cp3 only produces what's asked of it correct. So instead of one pump supplying all 26k giving all its got , having a second pump would still supply the press but add volume, so that would mean the second pump would really just be splitting the work of one. Thus making each pump work a lot less right ?

 

[Maxhdcrew]

You don't need to tune it yourself....

Just buy an autocal and it works like a canned tuner. Just better.

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Yeah but then again it's just a canned tuner a one size fits all, which is what I have now. So really six of one , half a dozen of another. Everybody has there favorites and there one and only tuner, brand, or opinion that works well for them. Not bashing efi but if I was going to spend the money on efi I would want to learn to tune it myself. That is the purpose of it, to make your own tunes. Anyone buying efi and just having a tuner send it to them with tunes is defeating the purpose and is essentially the same thing as a ppe, edge, ect. Your getting the same tunes that the other 100k people were sent also. Efi, to be worth is needs to be constantly updated and tuned as you drive until optimal performance is met with said mods. No tuner can send you a tune that going to be perfect for your truck, only way to do that is to live tune it. Which is what efi was really made to do. Unless you can tune or you go get live tuned then any tune your sent is essentially a canned tune..... I just find it easier to plug in and not have to utilize a computer and all that jazz. No need to switch through a bunch of tunes. I set it on one tune and drive. If I plan to race then I can change tunes, I don't see a car or truck in traffic and feel the need to race them, so a switch for me is unnecessary. One day after I learn a bit more a out the efi tables and tuning I might take a Crack at it but for now I'm content. Plus I'm in Kansas which has absolutely zero performance diesel shops or any knowledgeable places or people so it makes things a bit harder. Anything to do with diesel here people try to charge out the ass or flat out don't know what there talking about. Most are young guys with big exhaust and a tuner to make there pile smoke and think there cool and so fast. I was one of a handful of guys with a diesel that actually ran here at the track. My dodge went low 12s before it was totalled, didn't get to finish the build. Plan was a second pump and second charger so now that's my plan with this one, that's why I'm trying to get some info......

 

[aklbz]

They do divide the loads commanded thus putting less 'strain' on each. To get optimum performance with doing a twin setup will not be via a canned tuner. Please give a call to a reputable EFI tuner so you have a good running setup. Just my .02, install lift pump first, sell both your CP3's and PPE tuner and buy a sportsman or stroker based LBZ pump, purchase EFI Autocal and DSP5 through a good tuner then do twins if you feel the need. I'm running a 472 and my hottest tune is right near 900hp. I'm assuming you have a built trans since you are running the PPE on level 5?


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[Maxhdcrew]

They do divide the loads commanded thus putting less 'strain' on each. To get optimum performance with doing a twin setup will not be via a canned tuner. Please give a call to a reputable EFI tuner so you have a good running setup. Just my .02, install lift pump first, sell both your CP3's and PPE tuner and buy a sportsman or stroker based LBZ pump, purchase EFI Autocal and DSP5 through a good tuner then do twins if you feel the need. I'm running a 472 and my hottest tune is right near 900hp. I'm assuming you have a built trans since you are running the PPE on level 5?


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I'm not looking for that much, I'm building a motor now and no way I'm spending what they want for billet rods and a crank. So I'm going to keep it conservative. Just trying to get a few questions answered. I know what I plan to do with my build and such just had a question. Yes Im new to the site but not new to diesels. Stock Trans, I don't beat on my truck. Rarely do I ever spin it over 3k and don't think I've ever done a burn out in it. My dad owns a machine shop and we have raced my whole life and I've grown up in the shop. I drive like an old man, going fast and having gobs of power got old a long time ago. I just enjoy building and fabricating. I don't push the limits of things just because.

 

[aklbz]

You would be very happy with EFI tuning with five selectable on the fly tunes that are trans 'safe'. No need to do the 475 over stock it sounds.


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[AJH]

Yeah but then again it's just a canned tuner a one size fits all, which is what I have now. So really six of one , half a dozen of another. Everybody has there favorites and there one and only tuner, brand, or opinion that works well for them. Not bashing efi but if I was going to spend the money on efi I would want to learn to tune it myself. That is the purpose of it, to make your own tunes. Anyone buying efi and just having a tuner send it to them with tunes is defeating the purpose and is essentially the same thing as a ppe, edge, ect. Your getting the same tunes that the other 100k people were sent also. Efi, to be worth is needs to be constantly updated and tuned as you drive until optimal performance is met with said mods. No tuner can send you a tune that going to be perfect for your truck, only way to do that is to live tune it. Which is what efi was really made to do. Unless you can tune or you go get live tuned then any tune your sent is essentially a canned tune..... I just find it easier to plug in and not have to utilize a computer and all that jazz. No need to switch through a bunch of tunes. I set it on one tune and drive. If I plan to race then I can change tunes, I don't see a car or truck in traffic and feel the need to race them, so a switch for me is unnecessary. One day after I learn a bit more a out the efi tables and tuning I might take a Crack at it but for now I'm content. Plus I'm in Kansas which has absolutely zero performance diesel shops or any knowledgeable places or people so it makes things a bit harder. Anything to do with diesel here people try to charge out the ass or flat out don't know what there talking about. Most are young guys with big exhaust and a tuner to make there pile smoke and think there cool and so fast. I was one of a handful of guys with a diesel that actually ran here at the track. My dodge went low 12s before it was totalled, didn't get to finish the build. Plan was a second pump and second charger so now that's my plan with this one, that's why I'm trying to get some info......

You're telling me I can't log my truck and send that into my tuner and he won't modify it to my needs based off what he sees in the logs? GTFO :roflmao:

 

[Maxhdcrew]

You're telling me I can't log my truck and send that into my tuner and he won't modify it to my needs based off what he sees in the logs? GTFO :roflmao:

Yes you could but then again most don't do that..... most just buy an auto cal with 5 tunes and go. I'd rather do the tuning myself ..... again more hassle than I feel is worth it at this point. I never said you couldn't log and send to a tuner , but it's still not going to be what it would be if it was live tuned. I like to build and put my hands on what I do and have. Like I said if I do efi it will be my tuning not have someone else do it for me when I purchased a self tuning software to begin with. Double negative. To each there own like I said many times already. I asked a question you begin with and it turned into being told what I should do with everything I have because it's what you all have done or bought. Everyone else started shoving the efi thing in every post when I was looking for an answer about running 2 pumps. Never did I say what I was doing how I was doing it, what I had or where it was being used or what it was being used with...... for some reason everyone thinks there only one way to do things. Not everyone builds things to beat them to pieces. Chill out there willy Wonka don't take things out of context and be so snippy

 

[Maxhdcrew]

You would be very happy with EFI tuning with five selectable on the fly tunes that are trans 'safe'. No need to do the 475 over stock it sounds.


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I really looked at efi, and I'm sure it's great. I had planned on going that route later when my motors finished and I get the twins on it done. I've been learning and looking at a lot of tuning to set up a couple tunes myself and play with them. I just got an awesome deal on the ppe so I went that route and it works a lot better than most all the tuners I ran on the dodge. I try to learn everything I can before I jump into something so when I get into it I'm not stuck waiting.

 

[DAVe3283]

I kind of feel like I am beating a dead horse telling you the same thing over and over that you refuse to listen to, but here goes anway...

The reason we all like EFILive is because it is exactly NOT AT ALL like what you say. Sure, you can go to DuramaxTuner and buy a one-size-fits-"all" tune, but that is not what people on this forum do. The vendors here will work with your preferences and mods to create a tune unique to your truck and preferences (smoke, responsiveness, etc.). That's the point of having the ability to log, and work with your tuner. It isn't as necessary on a stock truck, since your truck is just like the other 100k guys' trucks, after all.

Second, the "dying out" at high speed could be from any number of things. It could be your rail pressure falling off, it could be defuel from a hurt trans, it could be a weird MAF limit, a limp mode, etc. The PPE tuner can't tell you any of that. You are throwing parts at the truck because you have no idea what is happening inside the engine. It might need a 2nd (or bigger) CP3, but it might well not.

Based on your claim that the trans is stock, I find draining the rail to be unlikely. You will nuke the stock trans in a spectacular fashion long before you run out of rail pressure, unless you happen to have one whipped CP3 on that truck, or a freak of a trans, or both.

Now, since you are throwing good money after bad and don't want to sell the dual CP3 setup, by all means, throw it on, and see if it gets better. If not, throw a lift pump on, and see if it gets better. If not, throw a 2nd turbo on and see if it gets better. :spit:

Or, you could use EFILive (or any logging tool) and determine what is causing your truck to fall off at high speeds, and fix the actual issue, not just guess at causes and throw parts at the truck. We are just trying to save you from unnecessary and complex mods that you don't need, and solve your root problem.

Finally, to reiterate what was stated earlier: a 2nd CP3 won't hurt the stock injectors or fuel system, so long as the dual-CP3 controller is working right. If that fails, then you have the potential to damage your fuel relief valve or even crack injector bodies, stock or not.