LBZ / ZF6 Compatibility

zf6mover

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Feb 2, 2024
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I have a 2003 LB7, 4x4 ZF6 single cab

Bought it from the original owner with 140K, 4 years ago. Bone stock except for single mass flywheel conversion. Currently has 229K, just put in a Southbend clutch, LB7 flywheel (original owner had an LLY flywheel in there) and ARP flywheel bolts. The only other upgrades I've done are KB Diesels steel clutch pedal (stock plastic one failed), Merchant Auto transfer case (pump rub did me in), ARB front bumper / 12k winch (after I hit a deer), K&N cleanable air filter. No tunes, and the engine is the low output CA emissions version.

Im dealing with a fuel issue that prompted me to rebuild the factory hand primer, replace the banjo washers at the FICM, and replace the Fuel Pressure Relief Valve, none of which solved the issue. Extended cranking times (15 to 30 seconds on every start), engine will only start cold. No hot starts at all. No cold starts in hot weather. Truck runs perfect once its on (runs better than when I bought it, thanks FPRV). Original owner claimed injectors were done at 100k. I have not replaced injectors in my ownership, and Im thinking they have high return rates. Rather than drop the coin on injectors + cups + CP3 and whatever else... there's a low miles LBZ engine (116K) for the same price that's for sale close by.

My goal for this truck is to reach 700K miles with proper maintenance but minimal intervention on my part. I have an aluminum van body on the bed, I drive coast to coast, and throughout most of Mexico. For me, Reliability is KEY. I have no doubt the LB7 can hit 700K (with 5 more sets of injectors). What all would I need to swap in the LBZ? The owner claims its an 07.

From digging around on the forum here, it looks like:

-2007 LBZ Engine

-2006 LBZ / LLY ECM for manual trans (since 2007 didn't have option for manual trans)

-LLY flywheel (still got the one from original owner, not missing any teeth).

-LBZ wiring harness on engine / under hood

-LBZ throttle pedal / harness


The LB7 is a Base Model, no cruise control, steering wheel controls, etc.


Is there anything Im missing or any reasons this will not work?

Will the LBZ outlast the LB7 in bone stock form?

Are there any big ticket maintenance items on the LBZ that are not present on the LB7?

Would the fuel mileage differ? Currently enjoying 23mpg

Please reply from a reliability standpoint, my current LB7 has enough horsepower for what I do, even being the CA version.

Thank you for taking the time to read this.
 

JoshH

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There is some confusion with LLY and LBZ. If you get an LLY flywheel, make sure it is for a 2006 LLY. The 2004-2005 LLY has a different counter weight that will not work with the LBZ crank. I only mention it because GM's use of the LLY RPO code in 2006 causes a lot of confusion.
 
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2004LB7

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What about putting a lift pump on it for now? It really sounds like you are getting air in the fuel lines. Have you tried the clear hose to check for bubbles?
 

Chevy1925

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If you pump the hand primer till hard and then crank during a hard start, will it start?
 

2004LB7

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No amount of priming will cause it to start when hot, and there's no air coming out of the bleeder screw on the hand primer when opened, only diesel
I'd do a return rate test. Hot fuel is thinner and will leak past the injectors and CP3 return quicker then cold "thicker" fuel. You might be borderline for what the CP3 can do during cranking when hot
 
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Chevy1925

don't know sh!t about IFS
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No amount of priming will cause it to start when hot, and there's no air coming out of the bleeder screw on the hand primer when opened, only diesel

This sounds like injectors and/or cp3. Like you said, return rate test is what I’d be doing next
 
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Bdsankey

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^Third for return test. As pointed out by others as the fuel warms up it gets thin and easily causes the exact issue you're experiencing when parts are worn, especially if you're not getting air at the bleed port.

Also SAC injectors honestly solve the injector reliability issue. They convert the older style injector that initially was VCO to a SAC nozzle which is what is used on the newer trucks.

With a ZF6 trans honestly the only real gain (in my opinion) you'd get from an LBZ possibly would be a VGT turbocharger for turbine braking on grades which can be accomplished with an external exhaust brake.
 
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2004LB7

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Fuel Specific Gravity Testing
Use a J 38641-B Diesel Fuel Quality Tester to measure the fuel specific gravity (API Rating). Follow the instructions on the tool to btain the proper temerpature-adjusted value. This information must be accurate for the proper diagnosis of the fuel system.

Fuel Injector Return Flow and Fuel Pressures
The fuel return from the fuel injectors to the tank will vary based on the API value of the fuel. Measure the Fuel API with the Diesel Fuel Quality Tester. For this reason the Fuel System Diagnosis-High Pressure Side values will vary for identifying a fuel injector or fuel pump concern. Use the following tables when referred to by the diagnostic. The first table is to be used during the initial diagnosis to identify the worst fuel injectors. After the fuel injectors that fail the first part of the test are replaced, the return flow from each fuel injector must be measured again. This is because the fuel system is returning less fuel to the tank, and thus the fuel pressure is higher during the retest. Failure to use the correct table may result in the replacement of good fuel injectors.

API Rating = Maximum Single Fuel Injector Return Flow = Maximum Fuel Injector Bank Return Flow
30-34 = 3 ml = 12 ml
35-39 = 4 ml = 16 ml
40-44 = 5 ml = 20 ml

Retesting Fuel Injector Return Flow Values
API Rating = Maximum Single Fuel Injector Return Flow = Maximum Fuel Injector Bank Return Flow = Fuel Pressure at cranking speed (FICM Disabled)
30-34 = 4 ml = 16 ml = 176-180 Mpa
35-39 = 5 ml = 20 ml = 134-178 Mpa
............................... 176-180 Mpa
40-44 = 5 ml = 20 ml =
114-135 Mpa