Fleece Freedom Series Heads?

[DAVe3283]

Has anyone run Fleece's Freedom Series LB7 heads? Curious about everyone's thoughts on them.

Backstory: I warped the heads on my Suburban. Will be about $500 in machine work to clean them up. Add another $1100 for screw-in cups.

Fleece has these heads on sale for just under $2000, and I'm wondering if it would be worth the extra $$$ to have cast-in cups.

 

[1FastBrick]

The Fleece heads may be the way to go. No more cups to leak or service.
considering what PPE wants for there Iron heads with cast in place sleeves Fleece seems like the way to go.

 

[Bdsankey]

I've used Fleece's heads on different engine generations and I've been very happy with the quality of their heads, they are certainly my "go to" for a fast cylinder head if a customer cannot wait for their local machine shop to get them turned around. If I didn't personally already have freshly reworked heads with threaded cups I'd have ordered the Fleece heads just to get rid of the cups and avoid having to get mine remanufactured/overhauled.

Usually they're $1099 per head, until 12/9/2022 they are $934.15 a head ($1868.30 per set) due to Fleece's 15% off sale.

 

[1FastBrick]

And Brad is also a dealer for Fleece if he can be of any assistance...

 

[DAVe3283]

I've ordered from Brad before, and based on that sale, will likely be ordering again very soon...

 

[2004LB7]

I'm voting stock heads because I'm cheap and if the cups are installed correctly they are pretty much trouble free. I wonder how it would hold up if the cups were JB Welded in instead of using loctite

 

[Bdsankey]

I'm voting stock heads because I'm cheap and if the cups are installed correctly they are pretty much trouble free. I wonder how it would hold up if the cups were JB Welded in instead of using loctite

The benefit is no downtime, updated/new casting, and a killer machine shop assembled them. For guys willing to wait it definitely is a "better value" to go to your local machine shop instead of buying new heads but for someone who wants to bulletproof their LB7 it's hard to pass up.

While cups aren't a major leak point, they certainly have/can. Once someone decides to make the jump to threaded cups it becomes even less of a price delta.

 

[Leadfoot]

What is the difference between driver and passenger side heads? I don't know why but I always thought they were ambidextrous.

 

[TheBac]

@$976/ea right now, you're money ahead buying the Fleece heads. No cups to mess with, either.

 

[Dozerboy]

I'm assuming you plan on keeping your suburban so I would definitely do a fleece head. That way you can eliminate the injector cups altogether. If you see selling it in the future then I would absolutely just go the cheap route.

 

[JoshH]

What is the difference between driver and passenger side heads? I don't know why but I always thought they were ambidextrous.

Freeze plugs are installed in different locations.

 

[Bdsankey]

What is the difference between driver and passenger side heads? I don't know why but I always thought they were ambidextrous.

Freeze plugs are installed in different locations.

Josh nailed it. The castings are 100% interchangeable left to right, Fleece pre-installs the freeze plugs in the coolant passages that make them location specific instead of having the installer doing that. It takes "installer error" out of the equation on the person bolting the heads on.

 

[1FastBrick]

I've ordered from Brad before, and based on that sale, will likely be ordering again very soon...

Good to hear. Then you know you save a little extra going that route...

 

[DAVe3283]

I'm assuming you plan on keeping your suburban so I would definitely do a fleece head. That way you can eliminate the injector cups altogether. If you see selling it in the future then I would absolutely just go the cheap route.

Yeah, I love this Suburban. Not too many out there with Quadrasteer, and it is in really good condition (or will be again soon...).

I did end up going with the Fleece heads. Will likely be a couple weeks before it is done, since I am sending the steering gear out to get freshened up too while I am in here.

 

[farmergreg]

Yeah, I love this Suburban. Not too many out there with Quadrasteer, and it is in really good condition (or will be again soon...).

I did end up going with the Fleece heads. Will likely be a couple weeks before it is done, since I am sending the steering gear out to get freshened up too while I am in here.

Long time lurker here. My LB7 is on the engine stand due to the cam pin shearing and 4 bent pushrods at 388K miles
I'm contemplating Fleece heads.
Any updates?

 

[DAVe3283]

The heads seem good so far. They appear to perform like stock, but with the bonus of no injector cups to deal with. I got them on sale, and at that price it was a no-brainer.

I don't put a ton of miles on the Suburban. I have less than 10,000 miles on the new heads, so it is hard to comment on long-term reliability. But I also see no signs of any problems to come.

Subjectively, examining the heads before installing them, the quality of the machine work seemed excellent. About the only complaint I have is the valve stems weren't all trimmed to the same height. They were within a couple thousandths of each other, which is totally fine, and no problems running it that way. I'm just nit-picking at this point though.

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[farmergreg]

I appreciate your input, I've had a hard time finding any "reviews" on them.
What are you running for injectors? I was all excited about the SAC00 but have heard mixed reviews.
I bought the truck new, I guess we're rebuilding it for sentimental reasons.

 

[DAVe3283]

I put S&S SAC45 in the Suburban, but I'm somewhat regretting that. They have been a pain in the butt to tune, won't clean up at idle, and have poor balance rates. They run fine under load, but I'm getting really tired of smelling diesel every time I'm stopped at a red light. They smell as bad as the worn out stock style injectors.

My brother put the Lincoln Diesel SAC45 in his truck, and they have been way better. They cost less, better balance rates, no diesel smell at idle after bumping the fuel pressure a tiny bit, and were a breeze to tune in comparison. That's what I'd run if I was needing a set of injectors right now.

I have another set of S&A SAC45 that I'll be putting in another truck later this summer (bought the two sets based on very good experience with the S&S SAC75 I put in my blue truck years ago). I am really curious if the 2nd set will work better. I'm almost hoping I got a bad set in the Suburban, though I'm not excited to have to change them out again if so.

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[Bdsankey]

I've used a few sets of them here with great results and have multiple customers I shipped them to (Dave being one of them). Personally I think they're a great piece (especially when they were on sale) that makes it hard to justify having a set of OEM heads gone through at the machine shop. My machine shop, on average, runs $600-$800 by the time they address any valves/guides/seats etc that need work wich is a major chunk of completely new/virgin castings, especially when OEM heads can be sold for a few hundred a set.

 

[farmergreg]

I've used a few sets of them here with great results and have multiple customers I shipped them to (Dave being one of them). Personally I think they're a great piece (especially when they were on sale) that makes it hard to justify having a set of OEM heads gone through at the machine shop. My machine shop, on average, runs $600-$800 by the time they address any valves/guides/seats etc that need work wich is a major chunk of completely new/virgin castings, especially when OEM heads can be sold for a few hundred a set.

Good to hear they're a decent product. Fleece is only 85 miles from me!
When's the next sale? (my motor could have timed it's demise a little better)