truck wont start after headgaskets

SickLL7Crenshaw

Billy The Kid
Mar 10, 2013
1,088
34
48
31
Mexico
My buddy had the same problem last week after a head gasket job. He bled everything and no codes. Ended up putting the charger to it and cranking it to boost and the sucker fired right off. Guess it wasn't turning over quite fast enough. Make sure your cam, crank, and fuel rail sensors are plugged in.
 

Veikra

Member
Dec 19, 2011
260
0
16
Montreal, Canada
FIXED Mistake but my friend assembled the fprv and dropped it on the bench. He puts it back together and that's was it. We installed the FPRV kit on disassembly weeks ago, and forgot about it. So today I went and did a bottle test...

Bingo.

Took off the valve, it split open as I took it out the rail.
I found the needle at the bottom of the valve, in the cavity inside the spring.

Put it back, test cranked it and it cough. Put everything back properly (wires etc) and she started without prime, on empty fuel rails.

So Wolf was right, and the other guy we talked to wasn't wrong but not entirely right either. Bare in mind most isuzus are self bleeding, so I found that weird to crack the high pressure side. Can't hurt to do it anyways.

My egr is not popping code so far. I might be lucky.

Two problem... open glowplug circuit code, we have a scanner now but it doesnt read full pressure or balance rate. I suspect this was bad before we did the job, as the truck wouldnt start below -10Celcius. Didnt find a fuse yet ??

Other is crank sensor related, probably the one on the flywheel since truck does not run without the one on the engine IIRC
 

DAVe3283

Heavy & Slow
Sep 3, 2009
3,727
296
83
Boise, ID, USA
OK, there is a lot of incorrect information in this thread. For the sake of people reading this in the future, I'm going to correct the major points.

Another thing I do to get my truck started faster is floor it while cranking (not sure if it actually does work or not but is starts rather quick when i do that).
This does nothing. The fuel quantity injected is defined in its own table in the tune, and has nothing to do with throttle position. On my LB7 I verified this by flooring the truck before cranking, and leaving my foot on the floor. Not only did it start just like normal, but it sat there and idled even though I still had it floored. I had to take my foot all the way off the throttle before it started listening to my input.

A "small" shot of ether?
Oh dear lord NO! The Duramax handles this a little better than the 6.2 & 6.5 of old (which would usually bend connecting rods immediately), but you can still screw up your engine with the violent pre-ignition. The only thing worse is the people who pour liquid diesel into the intake :mad:

Yes the injectors fire even if there is no fuel in the lines. My lb7 fired right up after head gaskets and injectors and sitting up for 2.5 years.
The injectors fire only when the fuel rail pressure is 10 MPa or higher. If the CP3 manages to compress air to 10 MPa (~1500 PSI), the injectors start firing. However, that is unlikely, as it is very difficult to compress air to 10 MPa. Odds are your fuel rails still had a bunch of fuel in them.

Finally, several people mentioned cracking injector lines. This is unnecessary on common rail engines, and can be quite dangerous. At the pressures the common rail system operates at, it can penetrate your skin, which can be fatal in some cases. Additionally, it can damage the sealing surface of the injector lines or fuel rail, causing them to leak permanently. The air in the lines will be compressed to virtually no volume once fuel reaches the CP3, then be purged out the injectors as soon as the rail reaches 10 MPa. Cracking the injector lines does more harm than good. I've never had to crack the lines to get a Duramax to start, and I've done 3 injector jobs.

Hopefully this will help someone searching in the future get the correct info.

having the same problem with my 01 lb7.
prime the hell out of it and it will fire and stay for about 10 secs then die.
is it continuing to die because air in the lines more than likely?
Odds are you have an air leak prior to the CP3. When you prime it, the fuel filter and lines are pressurized, preventing air from leaking in. Once the truck runs, it starts to draw the pressure down, eventually drawing a slight vacuum (which is how it gets fuel from the tank). If there is a leak, even an extremely small one, it will pull air in, and die.

To determine if this is the case, start the truck, and keep priming while it idles. If it keeps running as long as you pump and dies when you stop, then you almost certainly have a leak. The most likely candidates are a bad water in fuel sensor or bleeder screw. Usually, these will drip a bit when you've primed it as hard as you can, so hopefully you can find the leak that way.
 

WolfLMM

Making Chips
Nov 21, 2006
4,005
25
48
38
AL
OK, there is a lot of incorrect information in this thread. For the sake of people reading this in the future, I'm going to correct the major points.


This does nothing. The fuel quantity injected is defined in its own table in the tune, and has nothing to do with throttle position. On my LB7 I verified this by flooring the truck before cranking, and leaving my foot on the floor. Not only did it start just like normal, but it sat there and idled even though I still had it floored. I had to take my foot all the way off the throttle before it started listening to my input.


Oh dear lord NO! The Duramax handles this a little better than the 6.2 & 6.5 of old (which would usually bend connecting rods immediately), but you can still screw up your engine with the violent pre-ignition. The only thing worse is the people who pour liquid diesel into the intake :mad:


The injectors fire only when the fuel rail pressure is 10 MPa or higher. If the CP3 manages to compress air to 10 MPa (~1500 PSI), the injectors start firing. However, that is unlikely, as it is very difficult to compress air to 10 MPa. Odds are your fuel rails still had a bunch of fuel in them.

Finally, several people mentioned cracking injector lines. This is unnecessary on common rail engines, and can be quite dangerous. At the pressures the common rail system operates at, it can penetrate your skin, which can be fatal in some cases. Additionally, it can damage the sealing surface of the injector lines or fuel rail, causing them to leak permanently. The air in the lines will be compressed to virtually no volume once fuel reaches the CP3, then be purged out the injectors as soon as the rail reaches 10 MPa. Cracking the injector lines does more harm than good. I've never had to crack the lines to get a Duramax to start, and I've done 3 injector jobs.

Hopefully this will help someone searching in the future get the correct info.



Odds are you have an air leak prior to the CP3. When you prime it, the fuel filter and lines are pressurized, preventing air from leaking in. Once the truck runs, it starts to draw the pressure down, eventually drawing a slight vacuum (which is how it gets fuel from the tank). If there is a leak, even an extremely small one, it will pull air in, and die.

To determine if this is the case, start the truck, and keep priming while it idles. If it keeps running as long as you pump and dies when you stop, then you almost certainly have a leak. The most likely candidates are a bad water in fuel sensor or bleeder screw. Usually, these will drip a bit when you've primed it as hard as you can, so hopefully you can find the leak that way.


Dave, my fuel system was completely removed for over 2 years, I assure you there was no fuel in the rails or any part of the fuel system. 2nd it isn't hard to compress air to 1500psi, esp with a 26000psi pump..... 3rd air dissolves in the fuel at that pressure anyways, 4th cp3 is a high pressure low volume pump, cracking an injector line, which is around at least 5/16 diameter isn't going to produce a dangerous pressure stream...

Thanks for your input
 

DAVe3283

Heavy & Slow
Sep 3, 2009
3,727
296
83
Boise, ID, USA
Dave, my fuel system was completely removed for over 2 years, I assure you there was no fuel in the rails or any part of the fuel system. 2nd it isn't hard to compress air to 1500psi, esp with a 26000psi pump..... 3rd air dissolves in the fuel at that pressure anyways, 4th cp3 is a high pressure low volume pump, cracking an injector line, which is around at least 5/16 diameter isn't going to produce a dangerous pressure stream...

Thanks for your input
I agree, it is not hard to compress air to 1500 PSI when moving fuel. I guess what I am getting at is that since your CP3 had fuel on the input, it was just filling the rails with fuel, not adding a bunch of air. The volume of low pressure air that would be held at 1500 psi in the rails would be immense, is what I was trying to say. And yes, the air would dissolve into the fuel at that pressure, which is why it purges out the injectors, instead of staying in a pocket at a high point in your fuel system (like air in the cooling system can do).

As for point 4: Remember, a healthy stock CP3 moves north of 50 GPM, which is nearly a gallon PER SECOND. Assuming a 3/16" orifice, and 50 GPM, the CP3 will still make > 500 PSI on the outlet. That is less than a pressure washer, so still fairly safe. But if you only "crack" the line (loosen it a little), you can see very high pressures. Plus, that is where you risk eroding the sealing surface, and injecting yourself with diesel.

So completely removing a fuel rail fitting should be OK, but like I said earlier (and your own experience shows) it is unnecessary.
 

Duramax One

Vote for Pedro
Aug 11, 2012
140
0
16
Oroville, CA
it isn't hard to compress air to 1500psi, esp with a 26000psi pump.....

Even though the CP3 is a 26ksi pump, it is designed for incompressible fluids, not compressible ones. Unlike many hydraulic pumps, the CP3 is a piston design, so it does a better job at compressing air than vane pumps, but you would still be hard pressed to build the 1500 psi required to fire the injectors unless you had diesel flowing through the CP3 to quickly reduce the volume the air is occupying.
 

Veikra

Member
Dec 19, 2011
260
0
16
Montreal, Canada
FIXED FIXED FIXED FIXED FIXED FIXED FIXED FIXED FIXED FIXED FIXED FIXED

It was my FPRV. The truck fired in about 8-10 sec with empty fuel rails after I reassembled the valve. Turns out he dropped the valve and put the needle in the wrong spot, HUGE leak.

Probably still alive because the FPRV didnt allow high pressure diesel to come out of the injector lines when I cracked them. A experienced diesel tech told me it wouldnt fire without cracking those lines. Though it was bullshit since it's a common rail but gave it a try.

Truck runs but a little boost leak (probably from the Git-er-don egr delete shenanigans)

Valve lash made a huge difference in the sound, it's so quiet !

I would like to thanks everyone on here who helps out to diagnose other people's issues and :beer if we ever meet.
 

DAVe3283

Heavy & Slow
Sep 3, 2009
3,727
296
83
Boise, ID, USA
Glad you got it running! Sorry it was such an ordeal, but on the upside you can probably assemble the fuel system with your eyes closed. Gotta look on the bright side, right?