Oil cooler discussion continued from "Pistons?" Thread

[othrgrl]

I was going to just update the other thread but figured I would start a new one for oil coolers.

Condensed version of the oil cooler talk in the other thread.

Maybe it is engine oil temperature more than egts. Are egt's fine if the cool oil keeps cooling the piston then when the oil gets hot and provides insufficient cooling then egt's play a factor? Fact: Pistons and cylinders are heat generators. Egts are only one source of measuring heat. Engine oil temperature gives the egts a degree or a severeity level. So if you keep egt's in check, then engine oil temps stay in check. Do briefly and extremely high egt's make little difference when oil temps stay cool? Egt's over time do the damage. I think egt's are only severe if given time, kind of like the difference between a 3rd degree burn and a 1st degree burn. Both do their damage. If you get enough third degree events then will you eventually end up with 1st deg consequence?

You are running your gauge pre-cooler. What was your reason for putting it there? You are also running an external cooler, correct? If you had your gauge before you added the cooler, what kind of benefits did you see from it?

I installed my guage before I had the cooler. I would see average temps of 220+ just cruising around town. Put a small load behind it (or a bit of racing) and it would easily be 250+. When I decided to install the HTT I wanted some safety, being that it's only cooling is from oil, so I got the oil cooler too. Now my average around town temps are usually under 200, and even with my 37' toyhauler in tow I have to really work it to reach 240. Normal towing temps are 220ish with ambient temp in the 70s..

One thing that the cooler oil helped is the psi. Even when at operating temps the idle pressure is usually above 30, and hot cruise is above 60.

A side benefit was removing enough heat from the engine to allow me to remove the belt driven fan and run dual Taurus electric fans with out having coolant temp issues while towing.

Whether you want a thermostatic oil filter adapter or a plain adapter you need to know that the nipple for the oil filter is 13/16" x 16 thread and the o-ring seating area is 3.5" diameter.

Just ordered everything for my oil cooler:

Oil Cooler - make Summit price match CarShopInc.com
Oil Filter Mount - won't take a Duramax filter but I'll just get a filter that fits it.
4 - 1/2NPT to -12AN fittings for the adapter at the motor and the filter mount
4 - -12AN hose ends for the adapter and filter mount
2 - 90* -12AN hose fittings for at the oil cooler
10 ft of braided nylon 350PSI -12AN line
10" 1000 CFM electric fan - picked it up at their booth at a swap meet this weekend

Total with shipping and all was under $600. I'll wire the fan to a switch beside my oil temp gauge (what used to be my trans temp gauge) so that it's only on when I want it to be. You could also use a thermal fan switch to do it for you.

I like this setup more for me because the truck doesn't have to be moving to push air through the cooler and after a pass down the track I can sit in the pits with the truck idling and the fan on. I'll let you know what I see for temps.

Summit Racing was out of stock on the Fluidyne DB-30617 cooler and originally showed a ship date of 4-15 or something like that. They kept pushing the date back and it is now at 05-25. Since I am getting close to building and installing the motor I wanted to get one sooner. I called all my normal sources and no one had one in a warehouse. Found one at HRPWorld.com and someone bought it while I was trying to order it. I then started calling all of the Fluidyne dealers on their site and finally found one that had it. www.theboombopshop.com for $380 shipped. Just keeping everyone up to date. When I get it installed I will post what temps I see.

 

[juddski88]

awesome!!! i am really interested in doing this as well since i am currently working on my dual taurus fans as well

 

[sweetdiesel]

Where are you planning on installing the cooler and are you going to continue to use the stock cooler also or eliminate it all together?

I like the idea of the fan cooled .....hopefully it works good for you.

 

[MAXLLY]

Othrgirl, be careful with moving oil around. I mean this with respect, i am sure you know what you are doing.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/Plumbing/

This link is just scratching the surface... If it is a stock pump i would keep it REAL close to the engine, avoid reductions/increases in hoses and fittings.

Don't use a filter with the ..... crap forgot the name... drainback avoidance dealie... the interior cylinder... what the hell is it called.

 

[othrgrl]

Where are you planning on installing the cooler and are you going to continue to use the stock cooler also or eliminate it all together?

I like the idea of the fan cooled .....hopefully it works good for you.

I have the older style AirDog with the perpindicular mount and plan to move it back further towards the factory fuel cooler. I had an AmsOil bypass filtration system bolted up to the bottom of the body where there are 3 studs and a pointless heat shield from the factory with the filters hanging between the front D-shaft and the DS torsion bar. I now have the remote filter mounted there and will be putting the oil cooler behind the torsion bar crossmember. I am going to continue to use the factory cooler as well. I won't be putting a thermostatic oil filter sandwich or a thermostatic switch on it at all and will just run the fan off a relay controlled by a manual switch mounted beside the temp gauge I'll be using.

 

[Bentley]

When Summits dates move around like that it means it is a special order part... AKA, it will never be "in stock"... Sometimes you still have to call them to find out WTF is going on with some stuff.

 

[othrgrl]

Othrgirl, be careful with moving oil around. I mean this with respect, i am sure you know what you are doing.

http://www.pirate4x4.com/tech/billavista/Plumbing/

This link is just scratching the surface... If it is a stock pump i would keep it REAL close to the engine, avoid reductions/increases in hoses and fittings.

Don't use a filter with the ..... crap forgot the name... drainback avoidance dealie... the interior cylinder... what the hell is it called.

Thanks for the link, as you can see from my links I am using -12 AN fittings and line and will have 6 fittings total and about 8 ft of lines. It will be going 1 ft back to the remote filter, another 2-2.5 feet back to the cooler then straight back to the engine. Everything is also level to or slightly lower than the engine output so I don't have to worry about dry starts from the system draining to the oil pan

When Summits dates move around like that it means it is a special order part... AKA, it will never be "in stock"... Sometimes you still have to call them to find out WTF is going on with some stuff.

I knew Summit didn't stock the item and called them yesterday about it - they weren't sure when they'd get it. Then through calling all of my other sources found out that Fluidyne didn't have any when I ordered and just got 3 made and sent out to fill back orders but I had no way of knowing if any of those were mine. The guy at theboombopshop.com went and pulled it off the shelf to be sure they had it and it will be here early next week.

 

[Killerbee]

IMHO, and not trying to put out your fire, this is not a good idea for you. If you are cooling your oil between runs, what you are doing is reducing flow rate when you need it as high as you can get it. The added resistance from the EOC and related plumbing, plus the increased viscosity, is going to have just the opposite affect that you are after. Your oil temp is never going to be high enough to be worrisome on a 12 second load...FWIW.

IMHO, your effort would be better aligned with increasing (not decreasing) flow rate. A better oil pump IOW. One that keeps its flow curve progressing at the 4000 rpms you use under load, and reduces cavitation, etc.

So no disrespect intended, the TD-EOC is as efficient as they get for flow and heat rejection, it was modeled similar to the fluidyne 3" core etc, and I would love to get you into one, but IMO, it would not help you unless you have a sustained load.

 

[othrgrl]

IMHO, and not trying to put out your fire, this is not a good idea for you. If you are cooling your oil between runs, what you are doing is reducing flow rate when you need it as high as you can get it. The added resistance from the EOC and related plumbing, plus the increased viscosity, is going to have just the opposite affect that you are after. Your oil temp is never going to be high enough to be worrisome on a 12 second load...FWIW.

IMHO, your effort would be better aligned with increasing (not decreasing) flow rate. A better oil pump IOW. One that keeps its flow curve progressing at the 4000 rpms you use under load, and reduces cavitation, etc.

So no disrespect intended, the TD-EOC is as efficient as they get for flow and heat rejection, it was modeled similar to the fluidyne 3" core etc, and I would love to get you into one, but IMO, it would not help you unless you have a sustained load.

Thanks for the input, I know you have done alot of testing with your system. I'll be using my truck for sled pulling, drag racing, towing, and daily driving so it will see sustained loads and when I am at the tracks the faster I can cool things off the more passes I can comfortably get in a day. I have also been looking into pump options also. Do you think that a thermostatic sandwich filter adapter would be better? That way you are only adding resistance when the oil is hot enough to need to go to the cooler.

 

[Killerbee]

Dustin, I use a custom version of that adapter. I will tell you that the thermostatic mechanism is nearly worthless. It will negate a big % of cooler flow at higher rpm.

In truth a good temperature control mechanism is tough to do without adding pressure drop to the system. The Mocal is as close to perfect as I have found.

My advice, don't integrate any thermostatic control into the filter adapter. Keep them separate, and each as free flowing as possible. For example, the fittings that come with that adapter are unsuitable and highly restrictive to the 16 gpm you are trying to preserve.

 

[othrgrl]

Dustin, I use a custom version of that adapter. I will tell you that the thermostatic mechanism is nearly worthless. It will negate a big % of cooler flow at higher rpm.

In truth a good temperature control mechanism is tough to do without adding pressure drop to the system. The Mocal is as close to perfect as I have found.

My advice, don't integrate any thermostatic control into the filter adapter. Keep them separate, and each as free flowing as possible. For example, the fittings that come with that adapter are unsuitable and highly restrictive to the 16 gpm you are trying to preserve.

I have already laid out and ordered my system but am trying to make this thread as informative as possible for anyone looking to set up an external oil cooler on a D-Max.

I have a plain oil filter adapter with 1/2" NPT ports, a remote filter mount with 1/2" NPT ports, I am using 1/2" NPT to -12AN fittings on both of those, and the 30617 Fluidyne cooler has -12 AN fittings. I am using all -12 AN fittings and hose to connect them. A fan is the only thing I am using for temperature control - for now it'll be manually controlled by a switch but I may eventually wire in a thermostat.

 

[Killerbee]

I suggest you drill out any 1/2" npt fittings that you use.

 

[othrgrl]

I suggest you drill out any 1/2" npt fittings that you use.

I drilled all of the 1/2" npt to -12AN fittings out with a 5/8" drill bit so they are straight though. I also did some work on the spin on adapter to improve flow. The system shouldn't restrict flow much at all now. Will get some pics of everything install and let you know about the temps (pre-cooler) when it's up and running.

 

[othrgrl]

Pics:

Doesn't hang any lower than the AirDog, I actually moved it up a little further after these pics. It is a tight fit by the driveshaft though, but I doubt it will be an issue.

Also I ended up installing electric radiator fans (Flexlite) on my truck and wired this fan in with them so I don't have to worry about the switch. It's all automatic and has an over-ride switch to make them stay on if I want.

 

[racinmike77]

every time I shut down the racecar, we plug in the oil heater.

 

[othrgrl]

Does it have a turbo and pistons cooled by oil?

 

[othrgrl]

Time for an update:

First I noticed in the top post on here that I listed the oil filter mount as not taking a Duramax filter - that is incorrect, it will take a Duramax filter which has a 13/16 x 16 thread and 3.5" O-ring.

Now for results so far:

As I said I have this tied into the controller for my flex-a-lite electric radiator fans, when they come on it comes on. I put the temp sensor in before either cooler (stock or mine) so it is reading the oil temp as it comes out of the oil pan. Under normal driving after it gets warmed up it stays right at or just under 200* (same as my coolant temp). With me running it hard and messing around even with the bed packed full of stuff I haven't seen it reach 220* yet and it quickly recovers. If the weather holds out I'm going to make some 1/4 mile passes tonight and will let you know how it does then. I haven't towed heavy with it yet but when I do I'll update you then as well.

 

[Killerbee]

I haven't towed heavy with it yet but when I do I'll update you then as well.

That will be the most eye-opening.

 

[Turbotug]

Towing heavy without it would be even more so.

 

[othrgrl]

Pulled a 20ft bumper tow with another ECSB LT Duramax on it over an hour to the shop today. Note that this is at sea level and on fairly flat ground, so many may not consider this "real towing" but this is the terrain we have around here and I'm just sharing info.

First the oil cooler seems to be doing it's job well, even when I kept EGTs up (900-1000*) for extended periods on purpose I never got my oil temps to get up to 220* - measured before the stock or auxiliary cooler.

When I took it to the track I never got the oil temps to 220* either.