LLY engine build on a budget

[cstephens93]

I've heard the stock LLY engine is good for close to 600hp, but then you are playing with fire. I know some people have pushed 600hp like Mike Diesel, but since each truck is different, theres no telling what one truck will hold compares to the next.

Has anyone ever put LML internals in the LLY? Specifically connecting rods and pistons? Is this even worth doing? I know I could buy Carrilos but I dont know if I need them.

I'm just wanting to push about or a little over 600hp without having to do risk bending or throwing a rod or even cracking a piston.

Any suggestions as to what I should consider or look into? Such as using LB7 pistons, LML rods, or anything really? I dont have any plans on taking my truck to the track. I just have 218k on my motor and am considering ways to lengthen its life. Aside from going back to a stock tune haha

 

[CaptPhil]

Lb7 and lly pistons are the same. So your pistons are good.
I would not waste time with doing a rebuild with lml stuff. A set of rods aren't cheap but at least you know they are solid.
These days 600hp is pretty reliable with good tuning. Built trans, turbo, tuning, lift pump and you are pretty much there provided your cp3 is healthy enough to support it.

 

[cstephens93]

So as far as carrilo rods go, no machining is required?

Anything else to consider in addition to rods?

Also, I spoke with Rob at ATP asking how I could make 600hp with the appropriate upgrades, but he said its not doable without throwing a rod. I guess he meant with the stock rods correct?

S Phinney said his sons LLY is a daily driver with 600 plus on his stock engine, so I'm sure its doable. I just wanna be safe internally

 

[Yngdmax92]

I still dont see anything wrong with doing lbz rods as long as you stay on stock fuel. Thats my plan if mine ever bends a rod. lbz rods are proven to hold 600 plus.

 

[Ne-max]

If you cant afford to do it right the first time you cant afford to do it twice. Is it worth all the head ach for a extra 50hp? Just save money so when it does go you can do it right.

 

[cstephens93]

The more I think about it, the more I will lean towards carrilo rods if that can guarentee me a longer engine life, even If I dont push much more than 600hp.

So is there anything else aside from rods that I should consider?


Correction, Mike Diesel made close to 750hp with his stock internals. Thats crazy

 

[Ne-max]

Big singles make bottom end hold up better then twins and smaller chargers it seems like. It is a bad cycle. If you are going to do rods then you mine as well do pistons. If doing that then key your crank and get a af cam. Then main studs and head studs. Also dampner. That's why I say just save and run what you got

 

[cstephens93]

Big singles make bottom end hold up better then twins and smaller chargers it seems like. It is a bad cycle. If you are going to do rods then you mine as well do pistons. If doing that then key your crank and get a af cam. Then main studs and head studs. Also dampner. That's why I say just save and run what you got

My head hurts from thinking about how much that will cost me

 

[CaptPhil]

So as far as carrilo rods go, no machining is required?

Anything else to consider in addition to rods?

Also, I spoke with Rob at ATP asking how I could make 600hp with the appropriate upgrades, but he said its not doable without throwing a rod. I guess he meant with the stock rods correct?

S Phinney said his sons LLY is a daily driver with 600 plus on his stock engine, so I'm sure its doable. I just wanna be safe internally

That's nonsense, 600hp is fairly common now for stock bottom end. My blue truck is in the 600hp range with nothing but a turbo. Just have to realize that you can bend a rod at any time.

 

[Ne-max]

My head hurts from thinking about how much that will cost me

Rods 2500
pistons 1700
cam 1200
studs 750.00
damper 425
machine work 1000
gasket kit 500

Imagine spending 2500 on rods and having a stock piston fail and take them out...

Yes some people get lucky but plan on the worst

 

[cstephens93]

That's nonsense, 600hp is fairly common now for stock bottom end. My blue truck is in the 600hp range with nothing but a turbo. Just have to realize that you can bend a rod at any time.

Yeah thats what im scared to realize. Bending a rod at any time. So would carrilos alone be sufficient for making around 600 maybe more and not having to worry about the rods? Or is there something else that fails around that hp number

 

[cstephens93]

Rods 2500
pistons 1700
cam 1200
studs 750.00
damper 425
machine work 1000
gasket kit 500

Imagine spending 2500 on rods and having a stock piston fail and take them out...

Yes some people get lucky but plan on the worst

Yeah good point. How often do LLY pistons actually fail though? I know LBZs are more LIKELY but are LLY pistons even reliable at these hp ranges?

 

[S Phinney]

Stock pistons are reliable in that hp range. Rods are semi reliable in that hp range. Aftermarket rods are reliable up in the four digits . Good tuning is a must have. My son's truck has been as reliable as any other daily driver. When you turn the power up anything can happen. Hell I broke a crank on stock injectors and didn't make 550 hp. That's years ago when I ran some pre -canned tuning.

 

[cstephens93]

Glad you chimed in Shane. I'll be PMing you sooner or later in regards to engine building advice

 

[S Phinney]

Just remember like I told you that driving it around like any other normal truck doesn't put anymore wear than a stock truck. I have a truck that I drive everyday that has 431,200 miles on it. It has had some kind of tuning most all of its life. It has the original motor and original tranny.

 

[WisconsinHick1]

I am over 700hp with cut and coated LB7 pistons.

 

[Yngdmax92]

What gets me is some guys on here say they have built a short block for 5k-6k range. so delip pistons and rods. if you used lbz rods and didnt plan on making big power, your freshening up your engine and making it reliable for 600hp at the same time and getting the bottom all done for 2200-2500 dollars cheaper. So theoretically, you could almost do a rebuild twice rather then buying rods. I know i know, who wants to do that, but while throwing in lbz rods...you could always knock down the fuel a bit

 

[Turbo Performance]

Sticking with your original question, budget build. Why not just chuck a set of rods in it and call it good? Easy to get caught up in the you need everything if you swap rods conversation. Just fix the thing that is known to regularly fail at the power level you want now and roll with it. Even if you wreck a piston it's pretty much guaranteed it won't kill a full set of rods, you might not hurt any or maybe just have to replace one or two. My $.02 anyway.

On Edit: I agree with yngdmax92 post's line of thinking but LBZ rods still aren't guaranteed to live. You're still not sure how hard you could whip it with LBZ rods at 600hp and would still be somewhat tuning/turbo selection dependent.

 

[TheBac]

My head hurts from reading this thread.

Since when was 600 considered "safe" on a stock motor? Good Christ. Rob tells you its a risk, then maybe you should listen to him. I'd tell you the same damn thing.

What most of the newer guys on this forum dont seem to understand is that most people are on a budget of some kind.
Maybe, just maybe, you should lower your expectations UNTIL you can afford it in the correct way. Shortcuts get you nowhere.

 

[WisconsinHick1]

If I did a "budget" build again I would do rods, delipped pistons, key crank and cam, then a balancer and flex plate. Have the block cleaned up, balanced internals and new bearings then done.