Lesson from Japan.

McRat

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Aug 2, 2006
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I'm a big supporter of nuclear energy.

There have been only 3 significant accidents in over 14,000 years combined nuclear power plant operation. Only one involved loss of life, all were older designs, and at least 2 will be found to be operator error. None of the reactors had state-of-the-art controls. All three were cooling failures.

The Japanese reactor automatic control for core shutdown worked correctly. The problem is when an older reactor (the Japanese reactors were nearly 40 years old) is shut down, the cooling must be maintained for an extended period of time to avoid overheating the fuel pellets. When the reactor is running, the uranium changes into other radioactive elements which take time to decay into "cool" elements.

Since the reactor was shut down, it was supposed to rely on the backup diesel generators to provide the cooling water. But the tsunami took out the diesel engines. Then the battery backup system died. Their final cooling system was ocean water, but they waited too long to go that route. So the pellets overheated, releasing hydrogen, which apparently collected in the building structure and ignited, blowing the top of the building off, but not affecting the containment vessel for the core.

There are newer fuel designs that eliminate the overheating risk that ended up damaging the Japanese plant.

We need to research and BUILD more powerplants of the newer design so we can retire these older designs. Sadly there will be huge push to stop further nuclear power development because 40 year old tech isn't as safe as it could be.
 

countrycorey

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I agree this will come back and bite the US nuclear industry, I work in it so I will hear a lot about this in the near future.

Pat, do you know if their reactor design includes a steam driven isolation pump in case all power is lost?
 

McRat

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Aug 2, 2006
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I agree this will come back and bite the US nuclear industry, I work in it so I will hear a lot about this in the near future.

Pat, do you know if their reactor design includes a steam driven isolation pump in case all power is lost?

No, I don't know. I'm certainly no powerplant engineer, I just try to follow the tech a little since some of our customers are in that field.

All I know is the Japanese units in trouble are GE Mark I boiling-water reactors that are a 40 year old design. Chernobyl was an even older design boiling-water reactor and much less sophisticated.

Apparently, if all power is lost in the GE, it overheats the core, so it might not have a steam-driven backup system, or if it did, it boiled off too much water and couldn't pump new water into the system.

The newer GE designs are Advanced Boiling Water Reactors, and have many improvements in safety and control, and they do have steam-driven isolation pumps.
 

countrycorey

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The newer designs definitely have a lot more safeguards and better control systems. I think Chernobyl was a graphite moderated reactor, which were not allow to be used in the US.
 

Atouchofgrass

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Jun 19, 2010
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I am gonna start a battle with this but, i have too lay off some steam.. Now, i know they don't account for these kind of disasters, but Japan is in the "ring of fire".. What were they thinking putting a nuclear power plant there? Obviously for the reasons we have them hear, but don't you think they could have done some other form of energy, so this kind of disaster wouldn't happen to them? This is just my thought, any others?
 

countrycorey

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I am gonna start a battle with this but, i have too lay off some steam.. Now, i know they don't account for these kind of disasters, but Japan is in the "ring of fire".. What were they thinking putting a nuclear power plant there? Obviously for the reasons we have them hear, but don't you think they could have done some other form of energy, so this kind of disaster wouldn't happen to them? This is just my thought, any others?

The designers/builders should have researched the geography and the geographical history of the area and taken that into account when designing the plant to withstand the worst natural disasters that region has seen.

What I don't care for is all the media trying to scare the hell out of everyone reporting facts without giving the background information, like when they said the radiation level in the plant are 1000x's normal levels. Well the normal level is like 0.5 or 1 millirem/hr, which is less than what you get in an XRAY.
 

countrycorey

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Yes, it was graphite. Which meant when things went wrong, there wasn't much they could do.

That is what was seen burning in the core and also was scattered around the plant for several hundred yards emitting lots of radiation
 

Atouchofgrass

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Yep, when they have no idea.. I'll be the first too say i don't know squat compared too people that actually deal with it on a daily basis!
 

countrycorey

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Yep, when they have no idea.. I'll be the first too say i don't know squat compared too people that actually deal with it on a daily basis!

I don't think they want people outside of that industry to know about it, but to just take their word for it when they say it's bad for the environment and unsafe.
 

ZR1160

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Jan 12, 2007
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Having the back up generator in a Tsunami zone in a part of the of the world the has a high risk of earthquakes was a bad idea. 60ft above sea level is consider out of the tsunami zone.
 

McRat

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Well, they had their second hydrogen explosion. They are saying they are not sure if the fuel pellets melted, but hydrogen is not released unless the pellets start to melt. It's the zirconium coating on the pellets that reacts with water and breaks the water down to hydrogen and oxygen. The uranium itself is already uranium dioxide, so it won't react with water if it melts.

There is something I don't understand. If I understand things correctly the GE Mark I reactor is water moderated. That means they can control how much heat the core makes by slowing down the water flow speed around the core. But if the water is missing or turned to steam, the reaction is supposed to slow down. Apparently that is not how it worked in that situation. Perhaps the Mark I's are different?

In any case, those reactors should have been updated 10 years ago. That is the problem, not the tsunami or less even the earthquake.
 

jbarker@bankspower

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Mar 24, 2008
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Best explination i've seen yet, not my words, posted from another site:

What is going on here?
In the aftermath of the recent earthquake and tsunami in Japan, two nuclear power stations on the east coast of Japan have been experiencing problems. They are the Fukushima Daiichi ("daiichi" means "number one") and Fukushima Daini ("number two") sites, operated by the Tokyo Electric Power Company (or TEPCO). Site one has six reactors, and site two has four. The problematic reactors are #1, #2, and #3 at site one, which are the oldest of the ten and were due to be decommissioned this year.

In short, the earthquake combined with the tsunami have impaired the cooling systems at these reactors, which has made it difficult for TEPCO to shut them down completely. Reactor #1 is now considered safe after crew flooded the reactor with sea water. Reactor #3 was starting this process as this was originally written (6:00PM CST/11:00PM GST on March 13th). Site crew began preparing to add sea water to reactor #2 around 7:30AM GMT on March 14th, if a cooling procedure does not work.

The four reactors at site two did not have their systems impaired and have shut down normally.

Can this cause a nuclear explosion?
No. It is physically impossible for a nuclear power station to explode like a nuclear weapon.

Nuclear bombs work by causing a supercritical fission reaction in a very small space in an unbelievably small amount of time. They do this by using precisely-designed explosive charges to combine two subcritical masses of nuclear material so quickly that they bypass the critical stage and go directly to supercritical, and with enough force that the resulting supercritical mass cannot melt or blow itself apart before all of the material is fissioned.

Current nuclear power plants are designed around subcritical masses of radioactive material, which are manipulated into achieving sustained fission through the use of neutron moderators. The heat from this fission is used to convert water to steam, which drives electric generator turbines. (This is a drastic simplification.) They are not capable of achieving supercritical levels; the nuclear fuel would melt before this could occur, and a supercritical reaction is required for an explosion to occur.

Making a nuclear bomb is very difficult, and it is completely impossible for a nuclear reactor to accidentally become a bomb. Secondary systems, like cooling or turbines, can explode due to pressure and stress problems, but these are not nuclear explosions.

Is this a meltdown?
Technically, yes, but not in the way that most people think.

The term "meltdown" is not used within the nuclear industry, because it is insufficiently specific. The popular image of a meltdown is when a nuclear reactor's fuel core goes out of control and melts its way out of the containment facility. This has not happened and is unlikely to happen.

What has happened in reactor #1 and #3 is a "partial fuel melt". This means that the fuel core has suffered damage from heat but is still largely intact. No fuel has escaped containment. Core #2 may have experienced heat damage as well, but the details are not known yet. It is confirmed that reactor #2's containment has not been breached.

How did this happen? Aren't there safety systems?
When the earthquakes in Japan occurred on March 11th, all ten reactor cores "scrammed", which means that their control rods were inserted automatically. This shut down the active fission process, and the cores have remained shut down since then.

The problem is that even a scrammed reactor core generates "decay heat", which requires cooling. When the tsunami arrived shortly after the earthquake, it damaged the external power generators that the sites used to power their cooling systems. This meant that while the cores were shut down, they were still boiling off the water used as coolant.

This caused two further problems. First, the steam caused pressure to build up within the containment vessel. Second, once the water level subsided, parts of the fuel rods were exposed to air, causing the heat to build up more quickly, leading to core damage from the heat.

What are they doing about it?
From the very beginning, TEPCO has had the option to flood the reactor chambers with sea water, which would end the problems immediately. Unfortunately, this also destroys the reactors permanently. Doing so would not only cost TEPCO (and Japanese taxpayers) billions of dollars, but it would make that reactor unavailable for generating electricity during a nationwide disaster. The sea water method is a "last resort" in this sense, but it has always been an option.

To avoid this, TEPCO first took steps to bring the cooling systems back online and to reduce the pressure on the inside of the containment vessel. This involved bringing in external portable generators, repairing damaged systems, and venting steam and gases from inside the containment vessel. These methods worked for reactor #2 at site one, prior to complications; reactors four through six were shut down before for inspection before the earthquake hit.

In the end, TEPCO decided to avoid further risk and flooded reactor #1 with sea water. It is now considered safely under control. Reactor #3 is currently undergoing this process, and reactor #2 may undergo it if a venting procedure fails.

The four reactors at site two did not have their external power damaged by the tsunami, and are therefore operating normally, albeit in a post-scram shutdown state. They have not required any venting, and reactor #3 is already in full cold shutdown.

Is a "China Syndrome" meltdown possible?
No, any fuel melt situation at Fukushima will be limited, because the fuel is physically incapable of having a runaway fission reaction. This is due to their light water reactor design.

In a light water reactor, water is used as both a coolant for the fuel core and as a "neutron moderator". What a neutron moderator does is very technical (you can watch a lecture which includes this information here), but in short, when the neutron moderator is removed, the fission reaction will stop.

An LWR design limits the damage caused by a meltdown, because if all of the coolant is boiled away, the fission reaction will not keep going, because the coolant is also the moderator. The core will then only generate decay heat, which while dangerous and strong enough to melt the core, is not nearly as dangerous as an active fission reaction.

The containment vessel at Fukushima should be strong enough to resist breaching even during a decay heat meltdown. The amount of energy that could be produced by decay heat is easily calculated, and it is possible to design a container that will resist it. If it is not, and the core melts its way through the bottom of the vessel, it will end up in a large concrete barrier below the reactor. It is nearly impossible that a fuel melt caused by decay heat would penetrate this barrier. A containment vessel failure like this would result in a massive cleanup job but no leakage of nuclear material into the outside environment.

This is all moot, however, as flooding the reactor with sea water will prevent a fuel melt from progressing. TEPCO has already done this to reactor #1, and is in the process of doing it to #3. If any of the other reactors begin misbehaving, the sea water option will be available for those as well.

What was this about an explosion?
One of the byproducts of reactors like the ones at Fukushima is hydrogen. Normally this gas is vented and burned slowly. Due to the nature of the accident, the vented hydrogen gas was not properly burned as it was released. This led to a build up of hydrogen gas inside the reactor #1 building, but outside the containment vessel.

This gas ignited, causing the top of the largely cosmetic external shell to be blown off. This shell was made of sheet metal on a steel frame and did not require a great deal of force to be destroyed. The reactor itself was not damaged in this explosion, and there were only four minor injuries. This was a conventional chemical reaction and not a nuclear explosion.

You see what happened in the photo of the reactor housing. Note that other than losing the sheet metal covering on the top, the reactor building is intact. No containment breach has occurred.

At about 2:30AM GMT on March 14th, a similar explosion occurred at the reactor #3 building. This explosion was not unexpected, as TEPCO had warned that one might occur. The damage is still being assessed but it has been announced that the containment vessel was not breached and that the sea water process is continuing.

Around 7:30AM GMT on March 14th, it was announced that the explosion at reactor #2 has damaged the already limping cooling systems of reactor #2. It may also receive the sea water treatment if they are unable to use a venting procedure to restart the cooling systems.

Is there radiation leakage?
The radiation levels outside the plant are higher than usual due to the release of radioactive steam. These levels will go down and return to their normal levels, as no fuel has escaped containment.

For perspective, note that charts detailing detrimental radiation exposure start at 1 Gy, equivalent to 1 Sv; the radiation outside the problematic Fukushima reactors is being measured in micro-Svs per hour. The highest reported levels outside the Fukushima reactors has been around 1000 to 1500 micro-Svs per hour. This means that one would have to stay in this area for four to six weeks, 24 hours a day, without protection in order to experience the lowest level of radiation poisoning, which while unpleasant is not normally fatal. And this level will not stay where it is.

Also note the chart of normal radiation exposure levels from things like medical x-rays and airline flights.

There have also been very minor releases of radioactive reactor byproducts like iodine and cesium along with the steam. This material is less radioactive than the typical output of coal power plants. It is significant mainly as an indicator of the state of the reactor core.

I read that there's a plume of radioactive material heading across the Pacific.

In its current state, the steam blowing east from Japan across the pacific is less dangerous than living in Denver for a year. If it makes it across the ocean, it will be almost undetectable by the time it arrives, and completely harmless as the dangerous elements in the steam will have decayed by then.

What's this about fuel rods being exposed to the air?
When the coolant levels inside the reactor get low enough, the tops of the fuel rods will be exposed to the air inside the containment vessel. They have not been exposed to the external atmosphere and the containment vessels are all intact.

Can this end up like Chernobyl?
No, it cannot. for several reasons.
Chernobyl used graphite as a neutron moderator and water as a coolant. For complicated reasons, this meant that as the coolant heated up and converted to steam, the fission reaction intensified, converting even more water to steam, leading to a feedback effect. The Fukushima reactors use water as both the coolant and the neutron moderator, which means that as the water heats up and converts to steam, the reaction slows down instead. (The effect of the conversion of water coolant to steam on the performance of a nuclear reactor is known as the "void coefficient", and can be either positive or negative.)
Chernobyl was designed so that as the nuclear fuel heated up, the fission reaction intensified, heating the core even further, causing another feedback effect. In the Fukushima reactors, the fission reaction slows down as the fuel heats up. (The effect of heating of the nuclear fuel on the performance of a nuclear reactor is known as the "temperature coefficient", and can also be positive or negative.)
Chernobyl's graphite moderator was flammable, and when the reactor exploded, the radioactive graphite burned and ended up in the atmosphere. The Fukushima reactors use water as a neutron moderator, which is obviously not flammable.
Note that while Chernobyl used light water as a coolant (as distinct from heavy water), it was not a "light water reactor". The term LWR refers strictly to reactors that use light water for both cooling and neutron moderation.

The news said this was the worst nuclear power accident since Chernobyl, though.It's the only nuclear power plant accident of its type since Chernobyl. It's easy to be the worst in a sample size of one.

Is this like Three Mile Island?

There are similarities. The final effect on the world is likely to be similar: no deaths, minimal external contamination, and a tremendous PR disaster for the nuclear industry due to bad reporting by the media.