GTX turbos

[RPM Motorsports]

I have run a 42 Magnum (GT4508R with a GT4202R Comp Housing, Internally a 45 but looks like a 42) and I have now run a GTX4508R. The GTX4508R spools better, comes on quicker/stronger and makes about 5-6 PSI more boost. The same turbine housing was used on both turbos.

I am a BIG fan of quality Water cooled/ball bearing chargers as they seems to hold up better and are VERY reliable. As a matter of fact the 42 Magnum was sold off my truck and installed on Dmitri Millard’s original PPE twin turbo kit. The turbo was used by me for about 1-1.5 years and then it was put on Dmitri’s truck for about 3 years and had made numerous dyno pulls in excess of 1500 RWHP, a few 9 sec passes and won Diesel Power Challange (2010). Turbo is stil working good and is going on another project of his.

BALL BEARING OR NOTHING!!!!:thumb:

That turbo is Whoring it's way around... It was on the Chevelle for a short time, now it's the HP on top of two 475's on the Drag Truck.

 

[sweetdiesel]

Dan is correct on the spooling and you would probably gain a few pounds of boost.

I personally dont think they are woth the cost , but thats just me.


Joe and Nick have you guys ever run big twins? you really have no idea if you havnt!
ive ran both a semi large single (475) and large twins.


twinning is winning!

 

[MarkBroviak]

Dan is correct on the spooling and you would probably gain a few pounds of boost.

I personally dont think they are woth the cost , but thats just me.


Joe and Nick have you guys ever run big twins? you really have no idea if you havnt!
ive ran both a semi large single (475) and large twins.


twinning is winning!

I'm with Simon on this one, I've yet to have a GTX prove to me that they are worth the extra money they cost but to each his own. Twins for the win!

 

[zebiraross]

Ball bearing turbos, Garrett, Precision, bw efrs are superior to any journal bearing turbo. Quicker spool, better transient response, and more reliable with no chance of thrust bearings going bad because of thrust load. Precision won't even sell a journal bearing turbo to you if they know it's going on a diesel because they know the thrust bearings won't last. Bw journal bearing turbos seem to be more reliable the garrett /precision jb turbos.

Downfall is they are expensive.

 

[Kspen90]

Has anyone ran a set of BB twins? If this is a stupid question and will not work for some reason than excuse my ignorance.

 

[MarkBroviak]

Ball bearing turbos, Garrett, Precision, bw efrs are superior to any journal bearing turbo. Quicker spool, better transient response, and more reliable with no chance of thrust bearings going bad because of thrust load. Precision won't even sell a journal bearing turbo to you if they know it's going on a diesel because they know the thrust bearings won't last. Bw journal bearing turbos seem to be more reliable the garrett /precision jb turbos.

Downfall is they are expensive.

Sorry, I strongly dissagree with this statement as I have several in the scrap pile that are Garrett bb chargers that shit thrust bearings out of them and they aren't rebuildable. They now have some sort of core exchage program on them but customers have me replace them with jounal bearing carts because the price difference doesn't show up in the performance difference to the customers. Ball bearing carts are great if you are spinning them to the moon because they hold up better in those situations but I try not to spin turbos that hard so it's not been a big issue for me so I can't justify the cost difference to my customers.

 

[TeaBagger2006]

Oooooooohhh
The Good Ol Days
:rofl:

lol


ive learned a thing or 2 over time about turbos. i wouldnt spend the extra 800 dollars for a gtx series turbo. i would just go with a regular r series ball bearing turbo. 4202r
the difference is a billet comp wheel. when you get up there on that price range you're better off just getting a custom turbo built to do what you want

 

[zebiraross]

Sorry, I strongly dissagree with this statement as I have several in the scrap pile that are Garrett bb chargers that shit thrust bearings out of them and they aren't rebuildable. They now have some sort of core exchage program on them but customers have me replace them with jounal bearing carts because the price difference doesn't show up in the performance difference to the customers. Ball bearing carts are great if you are spinning them to the moon because they hold up better in those situations but I try not to spin turbos that hard so it's not been a big issue for me so I can't justify the cost difference to my customers.

Ball bearing turbos don't have thrust bearings. That's why they're "ball bearing" turbos. Just out of curiosity were the bb turbos that went bad true non molested, unmodified garretts or modified with different compressor housings/turbine housings/compressor wheels/turbine wheels etc. ..? If so I could certainly see one going bad. I'm not into sled pulling but from what I understand the higher competition sled pullers predominantly use bb turbos.

Out of all the bb turbos I've had or been around with rice rocketes, and snowmobiles, and trucks that were true non modified Garretts or Precisions the only time I've seen them fail is if they lose oil pressure or if a engine fails sending contamination through them.

Besides reliability, there are many other reasons bb turbos are better as earlier described. That being said, journal bearing turbos obviously have their place in the diesel world and
they are fantastic for a lot of applications. But bb turbos are still better all around turbos imo.

 

[jonathancasey19]

Thanks for the feedback. I personally love my garrett bb turbo. Never had an issue. In regards to my buddy's motor build, he's currently running an s366 double bat and is stuck between twinning it with s483 or switching to single gt4202r/gtx4202r. Would the performance gains be similar?

He hasn't even had the s366 for a year and just had to rebuild it.

 

[MarkBroviak]

Ball bearing turbos don't have thrust bearings. That's why they're "ball bearing" turbos. Just out of curiosity were the bb turbos that went bad true non molested, unmodified garretts or modified with different compressor housings/turbine housings/compressor wheels/turbine wheels etc. ..? If so I could certainly see one going bad. I'm not into sled pulling but from what I understand the higher competition sled pullers predominantly use bb turbos.

Out of all the bb turbos I've had or been around with rice rocketes, and snowmobiles, and trucks that were true non modified Garretts or Precisions the only time I've seen them fail is if they lose oil pressure or if a engine fails sending contamination through them.

Besides reliability, there are many other reasons bb turbos are better as earlier described. That being said, journal bearing turbos obviously have their place in the diesel world and
they are fantastic for a lot of applications. But bb turbos are still better all around turbos imo.

Some do have and the one's that don't have a spaver/backplate seal ring where the normal thrust bearing would be. As mentioned earlier in this thread there hae been issues with the exducer of the compressor wheel smacking the cover and when they do it burns the spacer up. Turbonetics turbos have thrust bearings in them same as the journal bearing turbos. I have seen them fail both ways. If you would have been at Schied's this year you could have seen plenty of Precision turbos fail at one event!

 

[Diesel Technology Source]

I will agree with Mark on this. I have installed 6 GTX turbos on different setups some twins and some singles. On the single setup trucks I have done every GTX turbo failed! With a off the shelf S475 we have made the same power as the Garrett GTX 76mm 4202 and for 1500 less dollars. The S400 is still running today and the Garret has been scrapped.

 

[x MadMAX DIESEL]

If you would have been at Schied's this year you could have seen plenty of Precision turbos fail at one event!

I thought a lot of the turbos failed were e.d. chargers sucking the bushing through from a bad weld? I've heard both stories now I don't know what to believe


Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk 2

 

[blackdirtymax]

I will agree with Mark on this. I have installed 6 GTX turbos on different setups some twins and some singles. On the single setup trucks I have done every GTX turbo failed! With a off the shelf S475 we have made the same power as the Garrett GTX 76mm 4202 and for 1500 less dollars. The S400 is still running today and the Garret has been scrapped.

So should I sell this one i got and go back with a journal bearing ? Just asking before you flip the script and think I'm be a smartass. Legit ?

 

[MarkBroviak]

I thought a lot of the turbos failed were e.d. chargers sucking the bushing through from a bad weld? I've heard both stories now I don't know what to believe


Sent from my PC36100 using Tapatalk 2

Both, there were alot of turbo failures this year at Schied's but not a single one of them were mine!

 

[sweetdiesel]

Garrett bb chargers that shit thrust bearings out of them and they aren't rebuildable. .

And seem to always fail a few nights before a race/pull

 

[DMAXchris]

I have 20k miles on my Bullseye charger. It spent a full season on a 2.6 truck prior to me getting it. No problems here. I think the GTX turbos are a waste of money. The two trucks I've been in with them were less than impressive. They dont seem to have the top end that that the Bullseye turbos have.

 

[05_LLY]

The gtx turbos imo are lazy to drive and lack on top end performance compared to an equal size borg charger and are not even a comparison to a bullseye or danville.

 

[LWATSON]

Since this discussion has been about durability and longevity, I'd like to ask a question about my personal setup. I've heard of 366s lasting only a year so it has me worried. I have a bullseye billet s475 and stock fuel. Its going on two years old 60k miles. Should I be rebuilding it every year or do the larger units hold up better?

 

[paint94979]

My BW S475 has been on for 3 years and lots of 1/4 mile passes with a slightly chipped wheel and its holding up fine

 

[Redbowties88]

I will agree with Mark on this. I have installed 6 GTX turbos on different setups some twins and some singles. On the single setup trucks I have done every GTX turbo failed! With a off the shelf S475 we have made the same power as the Garrett GTX 76mm 4202 and for 1500 less dollars. The S400 is still running today and the Garret has been scrapped.

I'm not trying to be a garrett nutswinger here, but if that's true you didn't take the GTX to it's full potential.

Airflow is airflow, and reguardless on if the GTX is "worth it" or is more/less reliable the fact remains that it flows more lbs/min and generally at higher pressure ratio's then the "off the shelf" bw475

Unless garrett lies on their charts...which i've never seen any evidence of.