Electric booster pump Instead of trans build

[jkholder09]

Just as the title states:
I am considering using a electric gerator pump and regulator that intakes from the 1/8" npt bung on a aftermarket deep pan and feeds the line pressure test port of the allison. Nothing fancy just a dump off back to pan for the regulator bleed.
Otherwise the trans will be stock. I was going to set the pressure at 250 to start.

The ultimate goal would be to have a gerator pump and electric motor mounted internal to the pan, and if at all possible controlled by the tcm using the g solenoid circuit controls to duty cycle a gate type relay for motor speed.

Does anyone have any input on a device like this?

It seems too simply but it potentially could be a very inexpensive diy upgrade to a stockish truck with a tune.

The test truck will be an lbz.

Thanks for any feedback. This may just be an awful idea.

 

[Mike L.]

Just as the title states:
I am considering using a electric gerator pump and regulator that intakes from the 1/8" npt bung on a aftermarket deep pan and feeds the line pressure test port of the allison. Nothing fancy just a dump off back to pan for the regulator bleed.
Otherwise the trans will be stock. I was going to set the pressure at 250 to start.

Does anyone have any input on a device like this?

It seems too simply but it potentially could be a very inexpensive diy upgrade to a stockish truck with a tune.

The test truck will be an lbz.

Thanks for any feedback. This may just be an awful idea.

C3 and C4 will only get 125 psi as it is regulated by control main. Thought you said you were smart?

 

[jkholder09]

C3 and C4 will only get 125 psi as it is regulated by control main. Thought you said you were smart?

Throw a hook in the water and I knew i would get a bite.
So add in a transgo jr is your suggestion?
Is there any thing else you can think of?

 

[Bustedknuckles]

Theoretically it should help, is there a pump available that will maintain those pressures long term?

 

[THEFERMANATOR]

And how would it maintain any more pressure than stock. The main line pressure regulator valve will just simply bleed the excess pressure off. The stock pump can already put out more pressure as it bleeds off alot of the pressure. If the pump couldn't, then adding in the regulator spring or shims wouldn't raise line pressure. All this could accomplish that I could see would be to add in a little more pressure at low RPM's, but once the RPM's come up the regualtor will simply dump the extra pressure and maintain what it does now.

 

[jkholder09]

And how would it maintain any more pressure than stock. The main line pressure regulator valve will just simply bleed the excess pressure off. The stock pump can already put out more pressure as it bleeds off alot of the pressure. If the pump couldn't, then adding in the regulator spring or shims wouldn't raise line pressure. All this could accomplish that I could see would be to add in a little more pressure at low RPM's, but once the RPM's come up the regualtor will simply dump the extra pressure and maintain what it does now.

I was planning on adding a significant amount of volume in hopes it would be more than the regulator could dump off.
The downside is the heat this modification will create.

 

[plowboy_lbz]

If you could get what you want to work and get the clutches to hold more power, wouldn't the TC be the next weakest link and slip at the high hp?

 

[jkholder09]

If you could get what you want to work and get the clutches to hold more power, wouldn't the TC be the next weakest link and slip at the high hp?

Yes probably it would.
I was basically looking at a 350 dollar modification that could be installed in an afternoon.
It is only a hypothetical. I have looked at pumps and pans etc.
I was hoping top work through it here before I dove in too far.

 

[JoshH]

You'll have to use something a lot bigger than a 1/8" NPT bung for it to pull fluid through if you want to have a pump that will be able to increase the pressure without cavitating.

 

[IOWA LLY]

If your successful in getting enough volume to overcome the bleed off of the factory pressure regulator valve at say cruising rpm, you will make way to much pressure in the higher rpm's as the factory pump will flow more as rpm's increase. (To a point)

This is a ridiculous idea and shows how little you know about the Allison. Go away and quit trying to convince people you know what your talking about.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Mike L.]

This is a ridiculous idea and shows how little you know about the Allison. Go away and quit trying to convince people you know what your talking about.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

Thank you. I wanted him to hear it from someone else.

 

[IOWA LLY]

I can't wait to hear him try and defend his idea....

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

 

[Hot COCOAL]

Yes probably it would.
I was basically looking at a 350 dollar modification that could be installed in an afternoon.
It is only a hypothetical. I have looked at pumps and pans etc.
I was hoping top work through it here before I dove in too far.

I'm all for being clever, but the transgojr upgrade for an LBZ costs $100 and takes a couple hours, and it's proven:thumb:



But don't let reality stop your creative juices from flowing, after all, good ideas usually come from many failed ones

 

[jkholder09]

If your successful in getting enough volume to overcome the bleed off of the factory pressure regulator valve at say cruising rpm, you will make way to much pressure in the higher rpm's as the factory pump will flow more as rpm's increase. (To a point)

This is a ridiculous idea and shows how little you know about the Allison. Go away and quit trying to convince people you know what your talking about.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Tapatalk 2

I had no intention of turning the pump on at cruise.
Are We slipping Allison's at cruise? This show the very little thought you put into the project.

I was thinking about a switch a fellow could turn on right before a truck pull, or race. Just something to let the weekend warrior go down the track with a lift pump and hot tune.

But thank you for pointing out how little I know about the Allison and belittling me the first time we talk.

 

[jkholder09]

You'll have to use something a lot bigger than a 1/8" NPT bung for it to pull fluid through if you want to have a pump that will be able to increase the pressure without cavitating.

That is a good point Josh. I found a setup that I think will fit in a deep pan. That would allow suction and the regulator dump to be submerged in the fluid. It may cause turbulence and air bubble still. I suppose I could test it in a fish tank or something. But thanks for taking the time to think out my idea and work it through your mind. You found a problem I did not consider.

 

[IOWA LLY]

I had no intention of turning the pump on at cruise.
Are We slipping Allison's at cruise? This show the very little thought you put into the project.

I was thinking about a switch a fellow could turn on right before a truck pull, or race. Just something to let the weekend warrior go down the track with a lift pump and hot tune.

But thank you for pointing out how little I know about the Allison and belittling me the first time we talk.

You still don't get it! The amount of flow the factory pump produces varies with rpm. My comment about cruising rpm was simply to try and make a point. In case you haven't noticed rpm's change drastically as you go down the track. (drag strip or pulling track) Not to mention some people raise shift points way up, others don't so operating rpm of such a device would vary wildly even if only used at WOT. So I stand by my statement that you will have completely uncontrolled line pressure doing what your talking about doing as rpm's go up or down.


And by the way, most guy's first time limping a stock 5 speed Allison is cruising down the highway with a trailer on and they lug it down on a hill and slip 5th gear. Or they get on a bit to pass someone and slip 5th. So YES, people are slipping them just "cruising" down the highway.

Stock 6 speeds generally slip the converter first when turned up and used for heavy towing. Adding line pressure would increase torque capacity of the oem converter clutch in theory, but it will also damage a stock converter over time as it's not built to withstand much additional line pressure.

I don't have to put much thought into your idea to know its a terrible one.

 

[Hot COCOAL]

That is a good point Josh. I found a setup that I think will fit in a deep pan. That would allow suction and the regulator dump to be submerged in the fluid. It may cause turbulence and air bubble still. I suppose I could test it in a fish tank or something. But thanks for taking the time to think out my idea and work it through your mind. You found a problem I did not consider.

When and if you test your idea, make sure to use a similarly viscous and weight of fluid to yeild the most accurate results:thumb:

 

[duratothemax]

Years back I was kind of thinking of the opposite idea to make a "variable line pressure" allison.

What my idea was, was to shim the main regulator way up (so yeah you have to take the trans out)...but then have a PWM variable-bleed solenoid on the pressure tap...then control the duty cycle of that solenoid based on throttle %. Lower throttle % and the solenoid would bleed off more to sump, thus lowering pressure....I think?

Sort of like the LML setup. Low pressure in cruise for lower temps, but could instantly ramp up pressure when throttle % goes above a certain point.

More trouble than its worth, and probably pointless, but it was just something that came to mind.

 

[Mike L.]

When and if you test your idea, make sure to use a similarly viscous and weight of fluid to yeild the most accurate results:thumb:

You need to step out of this one. It's over your head.

 

[Mike L.]

That is a good point Josh. I found a setup that I think will fit in a deep pan. That would allow suction and the regulator dump to be submerged in the fluid. It may cause turbulence and air bubble still. I suppose I could test it in a fish tank or something. But thanks for taking the time to think out my idea and work it through your mind. You found a problem I did not consider.

You are the problem you didn't consider. I could tell you exactly why it won't work. But as you said, you are smarter than I.