DHD Brace or Flat CV Angle?

[snowman22]

So I'm having a hard time deciding which to do. I'm on basically a stock size tire, but have the torsion bars cranked a little to help level the truck, but not completely level. It's cranked enough to change the CV angle, but not enough where I think I must drop the t-case.

My LB7 was 2wd so I don't have much experience launching in 4wd. I already have both sitting in my garage, DHD brace and t-case spacers. I'm just trying to only tear into the front end once and be done.

So, brace or flat CV's?

 

[c5fourj]

Both. Even with the brace I couldn't launch correctly until my cv axles were down. After having both it launches very smooth.

 

[snowman22]

Both. Even with the brace I couldn't launch correctly until my cv axles were down. After having both it launches very smooth.

It’s really either or at this point. I’m not interested in changing the ride height yet. I’m trying to figure out which one of the two is going to work the best. If I can’t get it going straight with one it will be back to the drawing board completely since the two don’t work together.


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[OregonDMAX]

It just doesn't work that way, a brace with cv's that aren't level isn't how the brace was really designed. And level cv's aren't good just on their own without a brace

 

[Vmyrhaug]

What about complete rare parts steering without brace?

 

[darkness]

What about complete rare parts steering without brace?

You still have a bent center link. The brace keeps it from rotating. I have all rare parts steering and a DHD brace. Works great.

 

[SSchmi5519]

Cognito 4-6 NTBD with mcgaugheys 2" lowering keys.

Completely flat steering parts and a leveled front end look.

 

[N2BRK]

What about complete rare parts steering without brace?

FYI - Rare Parts pitman arm is designed to articulate (read rolls right along with the centerlink instead of staying rigid like OEM). I swapped one in and pretzeled an otherwise fine setup. Then I added the DHD brace and all is good again

 

[hondarider552]

Tcase drop? Is this something new?

 

[Vmyrhaug]

FYI - Rare Parts pitman arm is designed to articulate (read rolls right along with the centerlink instead of staying rigid like OEM). I swapped one in and pretzeled an otherwise fine setup. Then I added the DHD brace and all is good again

That's strange, because mine stays rigrid. I have also tested it with a jack, and it does not move.
But i have the complete kit with pitman arm, idler arm, idler arm brackett and tie rods. And in mine setup it is the idler arm who stop the movment..

 

[N2BRK]

Correct. The Rare idler stays rigid. But the pitman swivels all over. The lack of pitman arm help in locating the centerlink lead to mine rolling as soon as I changed out the Moog for the Rare. The DHD made me good again.

 

[snowman22]

Cognito 4-6 NTBD with mcgaugheys 2" lowering keys.

Completely flat steering parts and a leveled front end look.

I thought about doing something like this, but most of these kits won't clear a factory wheel. I'm also concerned about ground clearance after dropping it all down to run the spindles.

This truck is by no means a race truck. I use it mainly to get up in the hills for camping/hunting and that's the main reason for getting it up a little. I need all the clearance I can get being a long bed.

The 4wd launch just might not be a thing for this truck. I might just get the CV's as close as I can handle, run the brace and see what it does.

 

[Bdsankey]

If you won't drop the front end back to where the CVs are flat then lower the rear end to level the truck. The DHD brace is phenomenal when the diff is in the factory location and then the CVs themselves hold up a hell of alot better. For example, Wade Mintern was running napa reman CV shafts at UCC and they held up to that kind of power. This isn't a case of "having your cake and eating it too". You either need to drop the CVs flat and deal with a rake or you're going to have to use a cognito PISK that will break over time and not do as good of a job as a DHD brace.




What do you need t-case spacers or a drop for? There's nothing for you to drop/space out.

 

[Chevy1925]

I thought about doing something like this, but most of these kits won't clear a factory wheel. I'm also concerned about ground clearance after dropping it all down to run the spindles.

This truck is by no means a race truck. I use it mainly to get up in the hills for camping/hunting and that's the main reason for getting it up a little. I need all the clearance I can get being a long bed.

The 4wd launch just might not be a thing for this truck. I might just get the CV's as close as I can handle, run the brace and see what it does.

the only thing you gain with a cranked front vs a lift kit lowered down is the front diff to ground clearance. This is a mute point as the rear diff will hang lower than the front even at stock height up front. So if it hits the front, its gunna hit the rear. A lift will give you more break over angle than just cranking the front because you will have a bit more lift over all compared to a cranked front end and you can get non torsion bar drop lifts as well that fix the drop down for the torsion bars.

hammering on that cranked front end in 4wd off road wont be much better than a boosted launch on the street. i bent my center link from heavy throttle in 4wd up cinder hills as the front end was hopping from too much air in the tires.

if you are set on keeping the cranked front end, id ditch the stock steering for the kyrptonite full front steering setup. id also put urethane bushings in the lower arms, get your self some good upper arms that allow for more droop and the rear crossmember brace that DHD sells. That will eliminate as much flex as possible to keep toe in at bay and parts alive. The DHD steering brace will NOT stop you from bending your center link. it will be your next weak link if the CV hold up.

a cranked front end amplifys ANY sort of play or movement in the front end due to the upward angle it gives and increases leverage on steering/suspension parts. this is why they suck ass at a launch.

 

[snowman22]

the only thing you gain with a cranked front vs a lift kit lowered down is the front diff to ground clearance. This is a mute point as the rear diff will hang lower than the front even at stock height up front. .

Good point, I never really thought the front was that much higher than bottom of the rear. If dropping the front doesn't make it lower than the rear, I'm good with that.

My ground clearance issues have always been high centering with this limo.

It already has poly bushings and kryptonite tie rods, but stock center link. I haven't put UCA on because I don't have a harsh ride. It's not cranked all that much and still has a decent amount of downward travel. When the time comes I will most likely get an aftermarket UCA to help, but Ill probably wait until the current ones are trashed.

I'll go see if I can find a spindle lift that will tuck the factory 18's. Otherwise I'll have to go find wheels I don't hate and ones that hopefully will stay together.

I also don't think the LCA bracket from DHD will fit my 15'. Seems to only be 01-10.

 

[Chevy1925]

Look at RCD. i believe they have one but not sure.

 

[SSchmi5519]

Same setup I said above

 

[snowman22]

Same setup I said above

I guess I have a new plan...


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[JoshH]

I know you have already come up with a plan, but I just want to clarify something. People keep saying "get your CVs flat", and you mention t-case spacers (assuming you mean front diff spacers to lower the front differential). It isn't so much the angle of the CV axle that causes problems with boosted launches as it is the angle of the tie rods, but in a stock suspesion/drivetrain configuration (without an lift or lowering components), the CV axles and tie rods are almost completely parallel with one another. The problem comes in when your tie rods are running up hill from the spindle. When the truck launches and weight transfer causes the front of the truck to rise, the angle on the tie rods becomes even more severe than it is at static height and creates a lot of stress on the other steering components which can lead to catastrophic failures. Having proper steering geometry along goes a long way to successful 4wd launches. On tune only trucks, I have done more than a few boosted launches without even having tie rods sleeves or anything and run well into the 13s just by lowering the front end with the torsion bar bolts.

 

[snowman22]

I know you have already come up with a plan, but I just want to clarify something. People keep saying "get your CVs flat", and you mention t-case spacers (assuming you mean front diff spacers to lower the front differential).

Yes, diff spacers. Hard to lower a transfer case bolted to a transmission:roflmao:

The dumb side of me didn't really think about the upward force on the center link that would cause it to essentially be bent in a "U" shape. Seems pretty damn obvious once you actually look at it.