Allison 6sp: Converter lockup?

skintback

Take this one to church
Mar 5, 2007
919
0
16
Florida
I have a guys truck here that the converter is not locking up until around 75-80mph or 4th gear running the 1/4 4x4 boosted launch it's a lmm 4094vvt 25overs 2cp3's 1058 I know lockup seems to become a problem after you start to make some good power but damn this is terrible i'll see what T/H does for it next time out.

Will a TCM tune fix this i know the guy isn't going to go for a lockup box.
 

skintback

Take this one to church
Mar 5, 2007
919
0
16
Florida
You can read the tcm but unable to tune it boy isn't that nice.

read i need to put in a A40 TCM cool
 
Last edited:

Tank222

New member
Feb 17, 2010
337
0
0
Frederick,MD
My trans feel's totally different in town haul mode vs regular mode. With out it on it kinda just blows threw the gear then locks up and like start's all over. When it's in tow haul mode it locks almost asap.
 

Mike L.

Got Sheep?
Staff member
Vendor/Sponsor
Aug 12, 2006
15,681
232
63
Fullerton CA
There are some federal laws in effect for TCC. There has to be a gaurantee that the converter clutch will not accidentaly lock and push through the brakes and kill someone. So there are safegaurds put into the strategy.
EFI or anyone else would be crazy to touch this if they could. I know that some of you guys would say " I'll take that responsability " but when the shit hits the fan you and your attorneys will burn anyone you can. You won't see a fix from the oem ever.
 

JoshH

Daggum farm truck
Staff member
Vendor/Sponsor
Feb 14, 2007
13,712
773
113
Texas!!!
There are some federal laws in effect for TCC. There has to be a gaurantee that the converter clutch will not accidentaly lock and push through the brakes and kill someone. So there are safegaurds put into the strategy.
EFI or anyone else would be crazy to touch this if they could. I know that some of you guys would say " I'll take that responsability " but when the shit hits the fan you and your attorneys will burn anyone you can. You won't see a fix from the oem ever.

I'm a little confused here, Mike. I don't see what a converter not locking up at full throttle has to do with federal law and their safety regulations. :confused:
 

blackdirtymax

New member
Apr 15, 2010
825
0
0
augusta, ga
I'm a little confused here, Mike. I don't see what a converter not locking up at full throttle has to do with federal law and their safety regulations. :confused:

i think he is just saying that in these particular tcm's , the provisions that keep it from accidently locking up at say a red light and pushing through the brakes unfortunately effect the lock-up of the converter up top. correct me if i am wrong Mike:eek:
 

duratothemax

<--- slippery roads
Aug 28, 2006
7,139
10
0
Wyoming
The reason the allison TCM wont lock up is this:

Whenever turbine vs. input speed 'delta' (sorry im not just trying to sound smart or sophisticated by saying that, honestly) is greater than ~650-700rpm, the TCM will inhibit lockup under ALL conditions. Also, if turbine vs. input speed delta is LESS THAN 0rpm (that is, the converter turbine is spinning faster than the engine, like if you are coasting down a hill at less than ~50mph in non-tow/haul mode), converter lockup is also inhibited.

The only reason for this is to prevent driveline shock (and potential damage to trans hard parts, and driveline components) under high speed differences, when the converter is slipping (multiplying torque) a lot before it couples. Note I said "COUPLES". Coupling is not the same thing as lockup.

The TCM inhibits lockup at high slip rpm's to allow the converter to "catch up" with itself and couple a bit so the slip speed is closer to zero...the closer the slip speed is to 0rpm, the less harsh the lockup will be (when it occurs/when its commanded by the TCM), because you arent trying to force engine speed/wheel speed differences to suddenly match. Like if you're going 40mph in a manual trans truck, clutch in, put it in 1st gear, then let the clutch out. Obviously not going to be very smooth.

So basically. Allison did this (put this programming in the TCM) only for "driveability" (so customers wouldnt complain about harsh lockup), and to prevent driveline shock, which could result in lots of warranty claims/breakage.

The TCM is infinitely programmable. To say "its programmed so it wont lockup from a stop, BUT that also means we're stuck with failure to lockup at high speeds too" is incorrect. Allison can make it do whatever they want with the software. This is a 21st century designed/programmed computer. You can have your cake AND eat it. ;)

So when you have big power and a looser converter, its easier to "blow through" the converter during a hard boosted launch, and therefore it takes a while for the converter to "catch up" (couple) enough to where slip speed drops below ~650rpm (and therefore crossing the threshold where the TCM will allow lockup to occur again).

Ive been saying this/explaining this over and over again for years...how come people are still asking why the TCM doesnt lockup at higher power levels etc...? :)

You have two options to fix this, and get the converter to lockup under big power:

A) custom TCM programming. If you can eliminate that inhibitor in the TCM calibration, you'll be all set. EFILive doesnt have access to this parameter [yet]. All of the TCM tables currently available for us WILL NOT FIX/HELP THIS ISSUE. Ive seen people say that they've made some gee-whiz magical TCM tune with EFILive that makes the converter lockup properly/predictably under all conditions but they are all full of crap.

B) aftermarket lockup controller. Im not saying this to try to sell my widget. Believe me I would love it if we had access to it in the software. It would be 10x easier and cleaner to make it work PROPERLY within the TCM and not a harness "fooler" box. But I dont think its going to happen because Ive been asking for probably close to 5 years and no one has had an answer

Ben
 
Last edited:

skintback

Take this one to church
Mar 5, 2007
919
0
16
Florida
Well i put the A40 TCM in and made some small adjustments and wow what a difference it made i guess now only time will tell if it learns back the bad habits
 

dwax

New member
Jul 21, 2009
127
0
0
i Have had the exact same issue since installing my twins. Im trying to buy a lockup controller and see if that works