Charged for fixing coding tuning?

[GMC_2002_Dmax]

I don't ever charge for retuning, I will usually offer as much help as I can if it's a tuning related issue, if it's a hard part causing the issue then often times it cannot be addressed with tuning as a bad part like a sticking regulator, wrong combination of parts, bad injector, etc is not something tuning can fix, if a part is bad , it's bad.

The P0299 is an easy fix.....

 

[JoshH]

The P0299 is an easy fix.....

They sure sound easy...

Sorry, but I have enough wasted time on this and another truck, I am done with wasting my time chasing my tail on P0299 underboost codes.

 

[IdahoRob]

These are the email streams from yesterday. I didn’t change anything except to remove the customer’s name and email address. I’ll let it speak for itself and then the gang rape can continue. This customer was a dealer at one point, but business dropped with us. This coincided with the last tune I sent over that was locked. The order before that one was locked but he requested the tuning was to be in the old software; I unlocked tuning that time but mentioned everything is now in the V8 format. Back on Sept. 5th I had a tune request from him and there was a problem with list pricing, the only business between us was two tune files in the last 17 months. My level one dealer starts at 1000.00 per running year. That order was cancelled by the customer. I have all the email streams saved on this also, but don't want to clutter things up more.

To wrap it up, I’m human and make mistakes. Did I make one here? Maybe. I find this stuff interesting, email and internet are great tools but I still try to teach my children how to speak to others if there is a conflict or disagreement. To hits some keys on a keyboard or pad and send an email saying “it’s fine” and then turn around post on the internet a half-truth to hurt a person/company seems odd. This person has always been polite when we have spoken and seems a good guy, so a bit surprised. Maybe it’s what human nature is becoming and just the sign of the times. I’m heading out of the country for some customer tuning so won’t have much of a chance to get back on to reply. Take care, Rob

Sent: Tuesday, April 08, 2014 1:30 PM
To: Rob Coddens
Subject: LMM coding issue
Hey Rob, I hope all is well your way sir. I have recently sold my truck to a fellow in Florida and he is having some issues with the infamous p299. I would code on me occasionally but apparently it doesn't like his driving style or the change in elevation. Is there an updated tune for it that can correct it?
I would also like a price on tuning a lml for a 4094 avnt...
On another note. I have a 2015 Denali I would like to tune with emissions equipment intact. Is this going to be possible anytime soon?
On Apr 9, 2014 Rob Coddens <[email protected]> wrote:
Hello Mr., I’m well thank you. I hope you are the same.

I’m sorry the new owner of the truck is having problems with the turbo you installed. The updated tuning works well but not 100% full proof but much better on the code. I can build new tuning for your truck. There is a tune update fee of 100.00 and I’ll update the full set of tunes. It appears we have not done business together in well over a year. We don’t have your billing info on record anymore, if you’d like to call and place the order I’ll put it in line for tuning.

Thank you,

Rob Coddens

From:
Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2014 4:04 PM
To: Rob Coddens
Subject: Re: LMM coding issue

Ok. That's fine. How about the LML with a 4094 AVNT tuning and my new truck which is a 2015 Denali...

On Apr 9, 2014 "Rob Coddens" <[email protected]> wrote:
Kory would be the one I recommend for a 4094 on a LML and there is nothing available for the 15 as of yet. EFI doesn’t release time frames so not sure.

Rob Coddens

From:
Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2014 4:30 PM
To: Rob Coddens
Subject: Re: LMM coding issue

Ok, he picked up a BMW 66 from Mark today instead of the 4094 if that makes any difference. I have done business with Kory in the past, I prefer your tuning to be honest but I guess Kory it is for the LML. I was under the impression the 2015 used the same ecu as the LML?

What needs to happen to get this retune rolling? I don't want to leave the new owner of my truck with a coding tune, I consider that unacceptable...

Thanks,

As I mentioned you’ll have to call and place the order with your billing info. I’m running about 7 business days out at this time.

Thank you,

Rob Coddens

On Apr 9, 2014 "Rob Coddens" <[email protected]> wrote:

Nice post on DD, if you have a problem with me, then I’d expect a man to do the right thing and call me and voice your opinions. Your tuning worked for you and your truck. This isn’t a simple code fix, but a complete tuning file change to fix the issue.

From: Sent: Wednesday, April 09, 2014 7:25 PM
To: Rob Coddens
Subject: RE: LMM coding issue
Rob you do know that you originally tuned my truck for a 4094 right?
Thanks,
Yes three years ago and worked well according to you. You have sold the truck and now it has issues three years after I tuned it. I would ask anyone to speak with me if they have issues and I can work with them and describe what it’ll take to fix an issue on my end and the other person can explain things and we come to an understanding. This is what I was taught and try to follow. Emailing saying things are fine and then bashing on the internet is an interesting thing to me. Please list the full story if you are going to start things on the internet instead of speaking with me.

 

[LBZ]

So did he originally pay for the tuning? If so why would you charge to fix a tune that you built? 3 weeks or 3 years what's the difference? It's your LOCKED tuning right? Would make sense to just fix it if they finally did complain.

Obviously if components have been swapped then a charge to fix the tune may be in order but come on, this isn't the case. I don't see the issue unless it was never paid for.

Personally I've lived with alot of things I have bought and wasn't happy with simply because I could get by with it or didn't have the time or energy to fight with the seller. Just cuz I'm not always the squeaky wheel shouldn't mean I should get penalized when I finally do get a chance to deal with it. (So long as it's still under warranty that is). Does tuning suddenly go bad?

Sent from my C6906 using Tapatalk

 

[Chevy1925]

So did he originally pay for the tuning? If so why would you charge to fix a tune that you built? 3 weeks or 3 years what's the difference? It's your LOCKED tuning right? Would make sense to just fix it if they finally did complain.

Obviously if components have been swapped then a charge to fix the tune may be in order but come on, this isn't the case. I don't see the issue unless it was never paid for.

Personally I've lived with alot of things I have bought and wasn't happy with simply because I could get by with it or didn't have the time or energy to fight with the seller. Just cuz I'm not always the squeaky wheel shouldn't mean I should get penalized when I finally do get a chance to deal with it. (So long as it's still under warranty that is). Does tuning suddenly go bad?

Sent from my C6906 using Tapatalk

If the truck was still owned by the OP, i would agree with this point but he had no issues till the new owner bought it and it became an issue. Does ATP have anything about tuning following the life of the truck or only staying with the original purchaser?

there is a whole lot of "gray area" in this situation imo

 

[LBZ]

He said he did have issues but was able to work with it. Whatever that means.

But If it's a locked tune. I would say that a tuner is obligated.

I agree a bit of a gray area but to me that just seems to be the honest and upfront way to go.
FWIW it's not like it's the only LMM out there with a 4094-it shouldn't be too big of a task to fix it.

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[PACougar]

If the truck was still owned by the OP, i would agree with this point but he had no issues till the new owner bought it and it became an issue. Does ATP have anything about tuning following the life of the truck or only staying with the original purchaser?

there is a whole lot of "gray area" in this situation imo

IMO that really comes down to standing behind your product. It's one thing to ask for something free, it's another to simply want what was wrong from the beginning made right. Does it really matter if he sold the truck, clearly it was never right to begin with. In the end I don't see this being good for anyone's reputation, I think most would agree they'd rather have someone tune their truck that is willing to back up their product.

 

[gmac32]

When I tune customer's trucks, I give them unlimited tuning with the same truck and no other add ons that would require different tuning. The way I see it, when someone pays for tuning it should be tuned until they are completely satisfied. There are also some people that will never be happy. I think the op should have had it fixed a long time ago if it was a issue.

 

[Chevy1925]

i just see it both ways from a business stand point and a customer stand point. this isnt "cut and dry" to me.

 

[PACougar]

i just see it both ways from a business stand point and a customer stand point. this isnt "cut and dry" to me.

I totally know what you mean James, I just never see a business benefiting from going this route. Why loose a customer over something like this.

 

[IdahoRob]

The tune is not locked.

It may have run poorly but in the three years after I tuned it, I was never told it didn't run well, just that it coded occasionally. I even called as he stated to ask how it was running, never said it was not right.

I went out a purchased a LMM and installed a modded turbo on it to figure out the issues. This was after I tuned his truck. If he told me the truck was running poorly in the last three years, I would of worked with him.

I'm not trying to "win" here just stating that there are other sides to the story. I run a business and stand behind my work. If I know there is a problem, I do my best to fix it. If I don't know there is a problem then it's hard to know what needs attention. So he purchased tuning for the truck three years ago, I never heard there was problems until the truck is sold and with another owner. I have to run a business and pay bills. Time is money. To create a tune file for a truck that is now coding, I gave a price and he said it was fine. To build new tuning and have it loaded into persons truck I have now accepted another marriage, even if the truck has a mechanical problem not related to the turbo, thus a fee for the time now and in the future.

 

[MACKIN]

They sure sound easy...

Sun of a Biscuit! Now you gone and done it!

 

[Chevy1925]

I totally know what you mean James, I just never see a business benefiting from going this route. Why loose a customer over something like this.

after this last post by rob, im with you guys now. He knew it coded, he had to know it would run poorly after having the LMM do it but because the OP lived with it till the truck sold or didnt become an issue because he didnt tow alot, its now not ATPs issue.

 

[MACKIN]

I have to agree with Rob here. The problem should have been addressed when the OP still owned the truck not after he sold it! In addition once you tune a truck does that mean that you have to tune it FOR EVER regardless of hardware change and or ownership? Tat is CRAZY if someone feels it should be that way!

Once the truck is sold first off if I was the tuner I would be done. Any other changes to the original owner and the tuning should be at the tuners discretion!

Just my opinion your mileage may vary!

 

[Cknight199]

So now it's okay to charge to fix tuning problems?

 

[S Phinney]

Just to give some insight into these modded turbo occasional issues, I have a truck that I tuned after two other well known tuners did. The truck would run great for a while and then just start going down hill. Everyone kept thinking it was the modded turbo. I didn't know who had tuned it before me or that this problem had followed with every other tuners work as well. After I tuned it everything was great for a few months then it started going down hill. They changed the turbo to a fixed vane 66 and I retuned it. Everything was great and ran the best it had ran. A few months later it goes down hill again. After investigating the whole scenario I recommended so trouble shooting from the shop that was doing the work. In the end the problem turned out to be a bad ground that was creating this issue. Electronics are a bitch when something gets out if whack. I'm not saying that this is his problem at all. The problem needs to be addressed between Rob and the OP and handled like responsible men. Three years is a long time to out up with a issue and not address with Rob. We are only hearing the important points if the OP in this and not necessarily the whole story. I am sure Rob will do what is right and best for his business and reputation. A hundred bucks isn't anything to argue about from either guys. I know my reputation means more the the money to me. Maybe that us why I am not rich.

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[MACKIN]

So now it's okay to charge to fix tuning problems?

How do you come to that conclusion? I don't believe anyone has said that. In this particular case (all cases can be different) the OP stated the truck had a issue he KNEW it had a issue some THREE years ago. Sold the truck to a new owner and now he wants the problem corrected. So it should be free of charge? I believe there should be some time frame or a policy on after the sale service!

 

[IdahoRob]

I may not have handled this the right way. We emailed thoughts and agreed on pricing, I didn't know there was a problem and based my decision on what I did know and his emails.

I then see this post.

If the customer would of contacted me and said instead of "that's fine" (I assume then there is not a problem), hey I don't agree and look the truck was always running poorly and I feel you should fix it for the next owner, then we could of hashed what was wrong and come to a solution.

 

[Cknight199]

How do you come to that conclusion? I don't believe anyone has said that. In this particular case (all cases can be different) the OP stated the truck had a issue he KNEW it had a issue some THREE years ago. Sold the truck to a new owner and now he wants the problem corrected. So it should be free of charge? I believe there should be some time frame or a policy on after the sale service!

I've just always assumed that tuning had a lifetime warranty against any problems that pop up that are tuning related. The tuning worked fine for the op, but once he sold the truck and the truck was worked differently there was problems that popped up.

 

[IdahoRob]

Maybe it has a lose boot? Maybe it has a leaking intercooler? I always wonder about abrupt changes with a truck when tuning is the same for long periods of time. Maybe it's sucky tuning, possible, but I never heard that before. Whether tuning or mechanical I'd sure have liked to know.