Capacitor sizing???

[serpa4]

Hello.
I posted this elsewhere for help also, so excuse the over simplification.

I don't know squat about electronics. However, maybe someone here can help. I replaced my engine driven fan on my 2007 with a set of electrics fans that are wired through a 30 amp fuse for each of the two fans. However, the fans are messing up my water/meth injection controller. The water/meth controller pumps a mix of water/meth into my intake manifold based on turbo boost. When my electric fan kicks in, the controller

 

[Mike]

Hello.
I posted this elsewhere for help also, so excuse the over simplification.

I don't know squat about electronics. However, maybe someone here can help. I replaced my engine driven fan on my 2007 with a set of electrics fans that are wired through a 30 amp fuse for each of the two fans. However, the fans are messing up my water/meth injection controller. The water/meth controller pumps a mix of water/meth into my intake manifold based on turbo boost. When my electric fan kicks in, the controller

 

[MAXLLY]

I'm gonna read it again, but want to offer this in case you are so deep in the forest you can't see the tree?. Ya know what i mean? Sometimes we get so involved we miss something easy. No disrespect intended. This is my first shot in the dark, stab at the issue.

I wanna look at signal and power. Where is the signal coming from that causes the reaction, is it at fault? Perhaps with (2) 30 amp fans we have exceeded the limitations of the power source and the ECM (or another source) can manage power as programming deams fit and required?

I'll read some more and try and get my brain wrapped around it.

 

[LarryJewell]

Not to steal your thread, but when you get the system working correctly, how bout a write-up on the benifits of your water/meth setup...

 

[serpa4]

Are your fans getting power from the batteries by way of fan relays? Are your fans permanent magnet type?
I’ll have to look, but am pretty sure the controller gets the power and then turns the fans on and off. It a PCM controller and modulates the flow to allow variable speeds. Not positive though.
Permanent magnet or electro magnet? Not sure. They are standard electric fans which are fixed magnet I believe.

I'm gonna read it again, but want to offer this in case you are so deep in the forest you can't see the tree?. Ya know what i mean? Sometimes we get so involved we miss something easy. No disrespect intended. This is my first shot in the dark, stab at the issue.

I wanna look at signal and power. Where is the signal coming from that causes the reaction, is it at fault?
I’m ASSuMEing the EMI is coming from the fan motor(s). 1) I can power the water/meth controller without powering the h2o pump and it still screws up. 2) I can leave the fan controller powered and running with just the pig tail connector from the fan controller to the fan disconnected and the problem is gone. So, I don’t think it’s the PCM fan controller or the water pump from the snow system.

Perhaps with (2) 30 amp fans we have exceeded the limitations of the power source and the ECM (or another source) can manage power as programming deams fit and required?
The fans are powered right off the little red power box under the hood that is just as good as directly to the battery. Plus I have powered the snow controller and pump straight off a completely isolated, fully charged battery and the fan still screws up the snow controller!!! That has got to be EMI imho. I’m baffled.

I'll read some more and try and get my brain wrapped around it.

Sure, I'll post on the water meth when working properly.

 

[MAXLLY]

ooof, this isn't a walk in the park! very tuff.

 

[serpa4]

Dead end again today. Applied 12 from bat directly to fan. Fan on high, system work fine. Fan on med system works fine, but on low, no go. I don't think its the fan since I hot wired it and it did not screw with the snow controller. However, I cannot run the fan on low without the controller, so.... I don't know.

 

[Mike]

serpa4, the only way to change the speed of an electric motor is to one, have taps in the windings that allow different speeds or two, change the voltage to the motor. Your controller changes the voltage by way of resistance. That is if you only have two wires leading into the motor. You might check with the manufacture for a solution to the no low. May just be a bad connection in the controller or, bad controller. Mick over in Australia had to reset his fan controller after a short condition. May pm him to see if the problem is close to what he experienced.

A capacitor removes an ac signal from a dc power source, charges for later discharge or changes a pulse signal. Well, there are more uses, but for the sake of your problems, I'm not sure a cap. addition will solve your woes.

 

[Killerbee]

How can the fan cause the boost to change unless it’s also messing with the truck computer and not just the water/meth controller?

I cannot return either unit since they were installed.

I hope a lot of people read about your experience. Your problems are not unusual. This vehicle does not have a ton of electrical system headroom. The original 145A alt, supplies only 110A when new at our rpms, at lower rpms, you get only about 80-90A. The truck uses 50A at night, just to have a heartbeat. As a stock vehicle from the factory, if everything is operating at peak efficiency, you have about 40-50 amps available, before you modify it.

Now start adding stuff, aftermarket stereo, some interior gauges, WMI, higher wattage headlights, lift pump, yada yada..your electrical supply overhead drops into the negative numbers.

Maybe you are drawing down the bus voltage with power deficit, and the PCM is very sensitive to that. I believe there is a different mode of operation when this happens. But anyway, if you go to dual alts (expensive), you may solve your problem.

Put a voltage gauge on your grounding block, and watch voltage there.

if it is causing your bus problems, you need to send it back, or you may cause other problems to your vehicle.

Oh, FWIW, I don't believe you have an emf issue. That would just mess with readings, not shut them down. IMO. But I may not fully understand your issue. In any event, if it doesn't work, I don't understand why you can't send it back.

 

[serpa4]

What is strange killerbee, it works fine on med and high with both fans running. It just when on fan is on low. I don't think its the power, but I know not. Only one fan is variable. The other is on/off with only hi. So, one fan controls the temp, when max is reached, and the one fan cannot bring temps donw, the other comes on full. The variable fan also come on at medium with the AC. So, when on low nothing works, but turn on the AC and its goes to medium and the snow controller starts reading boost and egt again. It is just messing with the readings as far as I know. When the snow is working, the LCD display shows boost, EGT and % injection. When the fan goes to low, the boost just says 0.0 and EFT says 000 and injection says 0% So, the controller doesn't shut down or stop working, the readings go to zero and thus doesn't inject because boost and/or EGT are zero even if the boost is 34 and egt 1300. The mechanical boost gauge and pyro that share the same boost line and EGT probe still work. I'm about to call SPAL, the controller mfg.

 

[Killerbee]

Before you do that, run a voltage test, looking for 13 volts with all switch settings. You may have some sort of short if there are separate windings, or the controller. But you should rule out voltage as a cause, and its easy to do.

What are the digital gauges you are referring to? Are they CAN bus gauges?

 

[serpa4]

The digital guage is the snow multifunction gage. I'll switch the fans around to see if the other fan that typically only comes on at high acts the same. This will eliminate problems with the fan. I wouldn't suspect that both fans have the same bad windings.

 

[dynarex]

when the fans are on low-isnt the motor feed being piped through a resistor ?
so being a bussed elect system you have some kinda voltage drop that is affecting whatever else in that bussed line(the snow controller)
i think the controller reads resistance and translates it into a boost/egt reading-so if the resistance on the bus line is being altered(low speed fan)
the controller is also being affected?
hows that sound?

 

[Mike]

The digital guage is the snow multifunction gage. I'll switch the fans around to see if the other fan that typically only comes on at high acts the same. This will eliminate problems with the fan. I wouldn't suspect that both fans have the same bad windings.

Would it be possible for you to click some pictures of the controller wiring as well as fan wiring? If you can, you may click a picture of the wiring schematic sent by the manufacture.

Thanks