big single question

knagel

weakest link finder
Jun 4, 2007
221
1
18
Central, Iowa
OK guys.... I haven't posted in a LONG time. Between kids and baseball games and a wife that wants to camp every weekend (wish she wanted to do something else every weekend) my pathetic life has not allowed me to mess with my Black boat anchor sitting in the garage. Since the build in..... well I think it was 2010, maybe it was 2009...can't remember, I have had about a dozen hooks on it and maybe 100 miles of driving. I have switched turbos 3 times and the current turbo I am running is a Batmowheel S480 3" with race cover T4 pedistal to Vband clamp .90A/R stainless turbin housing. The engine is a completly built SoCal enigne with pulling cam and stage 2 heads. It has dual fuelers and 60 over injectors. It has RDL up pipes and his Y bridge. The problem I am having is I can't get the thing to lite the turbo, no matter what size the turbo was, until about 75' on the sled track (about 2000-2100 RPM's). I am running a built trans with a 1053 coverter.

When I am at the line and bring the RPM's up slowly I can get to 1000 degrees on the pyro and build about 5-8 lbs. boost but it still won't lite. Alot of times the throttle pedal feels like when it gets to about 1600-1700 RPM's (about 30-40% by the log) there is nothing left in the throttle. Meaning it doesn't matter if you hold it at 40% or flat foot it to 100% there is no change in how the engine reacts. Is this normal? I have had 2 of the top tuners in the nation try to tune the truck and nothing has worked. 1 was a locked tune from out EAST so I couldn't even look at the tune or try to adjust it, the other was from a tuner from the North West. I know these tunners are top notch and know what they are doing and yet I still have a turd.

My question is what, if anything besides getting a looser converter or smaller turbo, can I do to make this thing more responsive to the throttle and lite quicker (no nitrous either). It just seems like there is nothing for throttle response to this thing.

Lets here your ideas.
 

Mike_S

OOPS!
Nov 18, 2009
803
0
0
40
Idaho
Timing plays a BIG role in it. I had an S480 with a 1.01 housing and cast wheel and i could light it with stock fuel system and 1057 convertor. Pull timing out in the areas that you are trying to light it. You want heat, that helps. Also, watch the fuel rates to see if indeed you are hitting a limiting factor, MAF limiting or otherwise. If so, bump it up untill you get the results you want.
 

super diesel

<<<< Under Pressure
A small 5gpm nozzle from a W/M injection pump set at about 6psi. Steam power is a POWERFUL thing. I do it up here at 6K elevation. Boost jumps up about 10-15 psi pretty quick and then you better be ready to go. If you want to go down this road and give it a try, I can give you places to go to get every thing and I can help with the nozzle and such if you want. This also helps greatly with the EGT control and cooling going down the track.
 

knagel

weakest link finder
Jun 4, 2007
221
1
18
Central, Iowa
I still have the stock MAF on the 5" intake tube. I have always wondered if this would have a roll in the no spool up. With an LBZ in the tuning you can select with or without MAF. In all the tunes that I am running the with MAF is selected. What would happen if a person selected w/o MAF? Is there a lot of tunning that would need to be changed? In talking to a lot of people thru the years it seems like the LBZ MAF table controlls more than what it is credited for. Would moving the curve down or up help on spool up ?
 

knagel

weakest link finder
Jun 4, 2007
221
1
18
Central, Iowa
A small 5gpm nozzle from a W/M injection pump set at about 6psi. Steam power is a POWERFUL thing. I do it up here at 6K elevation. Boost jumps up about 10-15 psi pretty quick and then you better be ready to go. If you want to go down this road and give it a try, I can give you places to go to get every thing and I can help with the nozzle and such if you want. This also helps greatly with the EGT control and cooling going down the track.

I have a custom 800psi water injection set up. It had 4 nozzles until I switched turbos, then I could only use 3. I can't remember what size they are right now. I'm hoping to maybe get a chance to work on this thing next week. Would like to this weekend but guess what..... baseball tournemants LOL
 

Mike_S

OOPS!
Nov 18, 2009
803
0
0
40
Idaho
I know on an LMM, if you choose "MAF not fitted" the damn thing wont run at all. Not sure on the LBZ. I bet that the 5" intake is screwing with you though if you havent rescaled the voltwge table. I have a 5" intake and my 464 has a hard time spooling if the MAF voltage table isnt set accordingly. Log it payimg close attemtion to the fuel rate and pedal position and whatnot, and see if it seems like it is limiting there.
 

knagel

weakest link finder
Jun 4, 2007
221
1
18
Central, Iowa
Timing plays a BIG role in it. I had an S480 with a 1.01 housing and cast wheel and i could light it with stock fuel system and 1057 convertor. Pull timing out in the areas that you are trying to light it. You want heat, that helps. Also, watch the fuel rates to see if indeed you are hitting a limiting factor, MAF limiting or otherwise. If so, bump it up untill you get the results you want.

I'm already at 3* timing at the 1700 RPM area. Less yet?
 

knagel

weakest link finder
Jun 4, 2007
221
1
18
Central, Iowa
I know on an LMM, if you choose "MAF not fitted" the damn thing wont run at all. Not sure on the LBZ. I bet that the 5" intake is screwing with you though if you havent rescaled the voltwge table. I have a 5" intake and my 464 has a hard time spooling if the MAF voltage table isnt set accordingly. Log it payimg close attemtion to the fuel rate and pedal position and whatnot, and see if it seems like it is limiting there.

How do you know what to scale the MAF table at or to for a 5" intake?
 

GeneralTJI

Turbo Todd
Jun 1, 2010
1,272
0
36
Colorado
I would bet the maf is limiting you being in a bigger tube. I had to scale mine for various intake setups...mine's in a 5" tube now and it took some tweaking... Add a chunk (%) across the board and work from there. Nice ride :thumb:

(4" tube has roughly 12 square inches of area, a 5" tube has roughly 18.75" so thats approx. 35% larger....)
 

Dan@PPE

Diesel Enthusiast
Aug 8, 2006
2,570
0
36
So Cal.
Yes the maf table (flow/voltage). this is a quick test then you can fine tune it from there.

Is it smoking while trying to spool?
 

knagel

weakest link finder
Jun 4, 2007
221
1
18
Central, Iowa
Yes the maf table (flow/voltage). this is a quick test then you can fine tune it from there.

Is it smoking while trying to spool?

lite haze until it really should be starting to spool. That is when there is no throttle response then black smoke. I'll see if I can find a vid quick and post it.
 

knagel

weakest link finder
Jun 4, 2007
221
1
18
Central, Iowa
these vids were with the bullseye s480 with a cast wheel and 1.01 ar housing. It still acts the same way with the batmowheel and stainless .90 housing.
 

knagel

weakest link finder
Jun 4, 2007
221
1
18
Central, Iowa
looks like the maf rescale will work... give it a try.

Will do! Here the most receint and only vid I have with the batmowheel. A lot less smoke but still not pulling thru the brakes on the line. Lit a little quicker but still not until 50 - 75 ' or so.