2009 LMM won't rev over 2k rpms.

JayPrimo

New member
Feb 8, 2020
20
0
0
Hey guys, brand new here but not to forums. Searched high and low, all I find in relation to this is clear fuel pressure issues with codes to match. I don't have those problems, and I'm at my wits end, spinning in circles for 2 weeks now. I'll try to keep it as short as possible, any details you may need and I left out I'll gladly fill in. I'm a fleet mechanic with 100's of GMC/Chevy Duramaxs from 2009-2019, so reference material is not an issue, and we're all stumped.

Got a 2009 GMC 2500 Duramax won't rev over 2k. I'm familiar with fueling issues, and this feels and sounds exactly like a limiter on a gas engine feels like, 2k rpms on the button. Other mechanic said he had it last month, only did it during regen and then it was fine. He replaced cmp sensor and ckp sensor and did an egr job also.

Now it does it all the time, park, neutral, drive, don't matter. No codes. Will throw a ckp code if you lay into this limiter but that's it. Everything on Tech2 checked out except 2 things. #2 balance rate was wonky, and my desired fuel pressure will not go over 13k on it's own. I can command it no problem, but will just dead end at 13k when it hits this limiter at 2k rpm.

I replaced #2 injector, no change. I ruled out exhaust/intake restrictions/leaks, swapped in known good ecm and tcm, no change. Wiggle tested the harness and the main harness failed by the ecm connections. replaced the main harness, no change. Hardlined cmp and ckp sensors to pcm and ruled out the injector harness. I ran it from a bottle and no bubbles, not even when it's bucking. Checked the FPRV, not a drop comes out, not even when it's bucking. I did a injector return test, replaced #8 for slightly failing, and #3 was fubar'd removing the return fitting, no change, and now those 2 injectors AND #2's balance rates are all wacked out. I now change the fuel filter just cause, and find my primer won't harden up. Other trucks I can essentualy stand on the plunger, this one I can push through and keep pumping. I start pinching lines, and when I pinch the fuel pump return right off the pump, the primer stiffens up and holds pressure. I'm not 100% sold at this point as it really doesn't feel like or check out as a fueling issue, so I start off with a regulator. No change, surprise.

Now my boss isn't 100% sold that it's a bad pump, and neither am I for that matter. My gut is telling me a check valve in the pump but all signs are steering me away from a fueling problem, mostly because of it's consistency at 2k rpm. You can sit at 1950rpm right as rain, then it hits a wall the second you touch 2k. We discovered that if you disconnect the cmp while it's running then try to do it, it shits down dead at 2krpm. Doesn't flutter, doesn't break up, 2k rpm, thump stall. Not sure what this means, but more reason I don't feel it's a pump with no answers. We have even scoped the cmp and ckp cause we came across the drive gear pin shearing issues, and we didn't see anything to say for certain the pin sheared.

We don't have a vacuum gauge, and i'm not even sure if it would help me here. I would gladly buy one but don't even know if it would help, truck starts up right as rain, even with the fuel primer staying soft.

Any input or help is greatly appreciated. My next orders are to tear down the front of the engine for visual inspection of the gearing, then do a pump on the way out, but if I can nail this down before I go in would make my day.
 

rmk800ak

Member
Jun 27, 2009
40
3
8
Fairbanks AK.
One concern is that primer not being solid. Have you checked the fuel lines for being flat ? One by the drivers side valve cover and next to the trans. If they are you will need to replace them. If the filter head hasn’t been rebuilt it might be worth rebuilding that and replacing the two lines. Also can you put a Evac suction on your fuel supply line and make sure the draw straw isn’t plugged or pinch. I’ve actually had mine suck flat in the tank and thought my CP3 failed. Also make sure your fuel filter is not the Napa style they tend to not push the check ball in the filter head all the way in. I’ve also heard a faulty fuel pressure sensor causing this might be worth swapping out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

2004LB7

Super Moderator
Staff member
Dec 15, 2010
7,108
2,213
113
Norcal
Yeah, it does sound fuel pressure related.

You can always replace the line coming out of the filter with a clear one to watch for bubbles. Also you can bypass the filter and line and rig a fuel can straight into the CP3 thus eliminating the rest of the lines if they are collapsed.
 

zakkb787

<that’s not me...
Sep 29, 2014
2,340
52
48
Granite Falls NC
This could be WAYYYYY off from what is happening, but I know when my truck loses its communication to the tcm because of a bad internal ground, my RPMs are severely limited as is my shifting obviously. Just throwing it out.
 

2004LB7

Super Moderator
Staff member
Dec 15, 2010
7,108
2,213
113
Norcal
Wouldn't that definitely throw a code though? His situation should throw a code too so who knows
 

JayPrimo

New member
Feb 8, 2020
20
0
0
One concern is that primer not being solid. Have you checked the fuel lines for being flat ? One by the drivers side valve cover and next to the trans. If they are you will need to replace them. If the filter head hasn’t been rebuilt it might be worth rebuilding that and replacing the two lines. Also can you put a Evac suction on your fuel supply line and make sure the draw straw isn’t plugged or pinch. I’ve actually had mine suck flat in the tank and thought my CP3 failed. Also make sure your fuel filter is not the Napa style they tend to not push the check ball in the filter head all the way in. I’ve also heard a faulty fuel pressure sensor causing this might be worth swapping out.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

This is my main concern personally also, and it is also the only anomaly outside of balance rates I have found on this truck wheb compared to another.

AC Delco filter, brand new. I've also isolated the filter head by pinching off the return and output. Builds prime, hardens up and retains pressure when isolated. Pinched off both injector returns, stays soft. Only when squeezing the pump return directly off the pump does it retain pressure.

As for the lines, the ones by the firewall are kinked and the ones next to the trans are flat. 2nd thing I found after injector #2. Was CERTAIN it was going to be my problem. Then I ran it out of the bottle eliminating those lines and nothing changed. I will be replacing the lines but they're not my problem.

The fuel pressure sensor hasn't given me any indication it's faulty. Reads and matches the desired all tbe way through, and reacts accordingly when unplugged. Also, np codes fuel pressure related. Definitly worth throwing it in there but I highly doubt it's the culprit
 

JayPrimo

New member
Feb 8, 2020
20
0
0
Yeah, it does sound fuel pressure related.

You can always replace the line coming out of the filter with a clear one to watch for bubbles. Also you can bypass the filter and line and rig a fuel can straight into the CP3 thus eliminating the rest of the lines if they are collapsed.

I agree with you, my gut says fuel pressure, but then the fact of it happening at 2000rpm on the button throws me off. Partial throttle, WOT, no indication of fueling issues, then 2k on the money bam, limiter. The desired hits 13k psi, then drops 1k-2k and comes back, lather rinse repeat, with the actual following right in suit. It seriously feels and looks like an ECM controlled limp or limiter. I even checked to make sure the ECM wasn't picking up a nonexistent PTO engaging, it feels and behaves too electronically/mechanically.
I did the bottle test but only to the firewall hardline, so engine side of fuel lines were all included. Zero bubbles into the bottle.
 

JayPrimo

New member
Feb 8, 2020
20
0
0
This could be WAYYYYY off from what is happening, but I know when my truck loses its communication to the tcm because of a bad internal ground, my RPMs are severely limited as is my shifting obviously. Just throwing it out.

I thought this too, and found trans fluid coming from the rear plug. The main harness has been replaced and I swapped in a good TCM, same thing. I thought possibly the internal harness had shorted and is maybe sending a signal to the ECM that a PTO is engaged, but nothing in the Tech2 would suggest this. The only pid I can find for PTO maintains disengaged the whole time it's happening.

I plan on replacing the internal harness also, but don't have much faith in it being my problem. Two ECM's wouldn't command a PTO limiter from a short without showing some kind of display on the Tech2, I wouldn't think.
 

JayPrimo

New member
Feb 8, 2020
20
0
0
Wouldn't that definitely throw a code though? His situation should throw a code too so who knows

The only code this lil bitch will give me is a CKP code SOMETIMES when I slam it into the limiter for a minute straight :mad:
 

darkness

Well-known member
Jul 15, 2009
1,326
388
83
48
vegas
Did you just get this truck? And if not did it just start happening out of the blue?
 

JayPrimo

New member
Feb 8, 2020
20
0
0
Did you just get this truck? And if not did it just start happening out of the blue?

No, it's a fleet vehicle, got a reman motor about 2yrs/20k ago. Looks like things like Turbo, Pump, Injectors, etc., were all swapped from old engine.
Vehicle had no problems til about 2 months ago, then it started doing this "rev limiter" thing only durig a regen. Fast forward a month and now it does it all the time.
 

JayPrimo

New member
Feb 8, 2020
20
0
0
Sounds like a bad CP3

That's what my gut is telling me. I feel like a relief valve is fluttering under load. I pinched off the tank return line and I can still get the primer to harden that way, so I don't suspect a crack in a hardline on the engine side.

It's really my only variable I can find in 2 weeks without totally ripping apart the engine.

Also my issue with condemning the CP3 is the damn thing makes pressure. I can crank it all the way up well over 20kpsi and its giving it, but will still stonewall at 2k rpm.

I'll throw a CP3 at it, we have no issues with that, i would just love to KNOW its bad before I do. Nothing worse than firing it up only to hear it doing the same thing, ya know.
 
Last edited:

Ron Nielson

Active member
Oct 11, 2009
773
147
43
Berryton, KS
I'm assuming that the DPF and CAT are not plugged? (unllikely) Have you scoped and looked at the waveforms for the MAF and Map sensor performance when this is happening? Have you scoped and looked at the waveforms for the LAN communications to see if anything abnormal happening there? Maybe other sensors? Are the ECM's you have used custom tuned or stock? Might try calling someone like John Kennedy and ask him if there is something in the tuning that turns on the light bulb for him. My tuning from John really picks up at 2K; yours is falling flat at 2K. Something is failing at 2K RPM, that's for sure, and it sure sounds electronic to me.
 

2004LB7

Super Moderator
Staff member
Dec 15, 2010
7,108
2,213
113
Norcal
I think it is the ECM limiting the RPMs to 2k. Just like limp mode.

What is causing limp mode is what we need to figure out. There should be a message or code associated with this.
 

JayPrimo

New member
Feb 8, 2020
20
0
0
Haven't scoped any of them because I really haven't felt the need to. Everything looks kosher on Tech2 until it starts bouncing, then the maf and map start fluctiating but I chalk that up to the bucking, they read and behave normal until the limiter kicks in.

Can't say I checked the LAN comms., didn't think of that at all.

Exhaust was popped off from the turbo downpipe, no change. Truck was run with nothing attached to the intake, straight N/A engine, same thing.

100% stock truck, stock ECM's. Nothing modified in that sense.
 

JayPrimo

New member
Feb 8, 2020
20
0
0
I think it is the ECM limiting the RPMs to 2k. Just like limp mode.

What is causing limp mode is what we need to figure out. There should be a message or code associated with this.

Exactly. I started tear down for the pump today. I'm going with my gut instincts and "back to basics" mentality and focusing on that fuel primer. I had the return from the pump clamped off at the pump the entire teardown until I got to fuel lines, and that plunger stayed rock solid the entire time. The second I unclamped it, plunger softens up and I can pump until my arm falls off....it's the only variable I can come up with.

I'll keep you guys posted what happens with the pump. Gonna see if the boss wants to take off the front cover. If no, I should have it back together tomorrow.

Thanks for all the input everyone
 

TheBac

Why do I keep doing this?
Staff member
Apr 19, 2008
15,677
1,944
113
Mid Michigan
Well, no matter what happens.....please stick around. You'll find this is a great group of Dmax people. Good luck.