this might be a silly question but can there be anything gained cooling wise to run ice in my water tank when i run at the track? or does it spray at such a fine mist does water temp not matter?
thanks
Travis
thanks
Travis
water/meth question
- Thread starter bullfrogjohnson
- Start date
If you are running meth, the temp when the meth evaporates is much lower than ice. I don't remember the temps but i know Buick guys were getting VERY low intake temps with just straight meth.
the heat absorbed when the water evaporates (change of state), is 20 fold what a 100 degree temp change without a change of state.
So it is a negligible impact to cool the water first.
If you have a water-air IC, it is different.
You may want to try one stage that mists (water) directly onto the turbo, though be sure you know what you are doing so you don't FOD the blades.
The magic of a water-meth mix, is that you can evaporate either component independent of the others saturation fraction. IOW, even after you reach 100% humidity with water, meth can still evaporate. That is a great asset, but few folks get good evaporation post CAC, and most water enters the chamber as drops. Pre-turbo injection fixes that problem, namely the violent interaction necessary to force evaporation in a short amount of time. Time is the killer. At WOT, air spends about .3 seconds in the entire induction system, so getting effective evaporation is the biggest challenge. Smaller drops can help, but evaporation is still monumentally challenging, in a 200 mph conduit that lasts the blink of an eye.
sounds like PRE if they are saying its best to shoot the mist directly into the intake of the charger....
what I got from it was to be sure and get the mist as fine as you can so it's as close to evaporative as possible???? To me. that means run a big MFin pump. And that (the pump) is what sets a Haisley, Scheid or Klikkel system apart from say a Snow performance kit. Those system can feed multiple nozzles with a LOT of PSI. Of course, that's speculation but almost has to be the case IMO.
C-ya
what I got from it was to be sure and get the mist as fine as you can so it's as close to evaporative as possible???? To me. that means run a big MFin pump. And that (the pump) is what sets a Haisley, Scheid or Klikkel system apart from say a Snow performance kit. Those system can feed multiple nozzles with a LOT of PSI. Of course, that's speculation but almost has to be the case IMO.
C-ya
from my research (no personal experience), the finer the mist, the better as far as erosion and integrity of the charger.
C-ya
C-ya
Another question would be, what methanol/water ratio can you use without problems on a diesel engine? I always run straight methanol in my Camaro to support a lot of boost on pump fuel (I can get inlet temps below ambient), but on a gas engine it is always way on the rich side of the air/fuel ratio.
I'm sure there are different parameters with a diesel that can be disasterous by injecting methanol where the mixture is too lean. Any more info on this?
I'm sure there are different parameters with a diesel that can be disasterous by injecting methanol where the mixture is too lean. Any more info on this?
The guy from Labonte Motorsports just said over on DP that 50/50 Water to meth/eth is going to be the best combo for power/cooling, anything over is going to create EGTs, less (or at least no meth) is going to cause loss of power, like CamcoJB experienced.
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I'm running the Snow stage 3 kit. I can't really give any hard numbers on what I'm seeing + or -, but you can definately fell the power increase when it starts spraying. I run a 20% meth to H2O ratio. My EGT's were 1400 at the end of the last sled pull. I've never seen them that low and I'm spraying it from 2 nozzels post CAC. fwiw. Or non-CAC, since I don't have one
Yes the train has no intercooler....... Intercooler's are just good for catching broken charger parts. Or, intercoolers are good for Tow vechicles.
See any intercooler on the Banks truck? Also ever wonder how much a "Heat soaked" intercooler helps on a dyno?
Yes the train has no intercooler....... Intercooler's are just good for catching broken charger parts. Or, intercoolers are good for Tow vechicles.
See any intercooler on the Banks truck? Also ever wonder how much a "Heat soaked" intercooler helps on a dyno?
Makes sense! Can you post of a pic of where you tapped? Do you like the snow? Im deciding in the very near future between the Snow stage 2 or 3, or the new Labonte Motorsports Kit.
I've heard too much meth can cause problems with advanced timing. Not sure if its true, but when I ran home brew 50/50 mixed myself, it sure was loud and rattled at WOT. I'm now running the 35%ish Blue stuff from Wal-Mart (-25 degrees) at $1.29 a gallon. Its a lot quieter and still can feel it kick in. I haven't towed, but EGT should also be lower with more H2O. Even 100 water is suposidly good for 20 hp. I'm pretty sure, from reading, that over 50% in a diesel is asking for trouble quickly. Too much advance. I think the meth ignites before the diesel does, like advancing timing.
I'm a rookie, so don't give my info too much value.
I'm a rookie, so don't give my info too much value.
P.S. I'm disappointed in the snow 3. Its advertiesed as 3D map with boot and egt support. Not true. Only one or the other, but not at the same time. I.e. If I'm in town racing, on egt mode, it will not inject till I'm hot and vis a verse, on boost mode, it won't inject at say 10 psi boost even if the turbo is about to melt. I've kept it because I found it could be better this way for me. If I'm hitting a hill with 15 psi boost but not hot, it will not inject in EGT mode saving fluid. However, if I needed the power to pull a hill and had an egt friendly tune, it would not inject since egts are under control so I'm missing the extra 50+ hp and 100 tq. I'd have to switch to boost mode. It really needs to operate in 3 modes, boost, EGT, and both (true 3D mapping).
We are working on lowering the EGT's. On a DD this is more of a concern.
The Snow kit may not work for everyones need's
I set the boost only switch to activate around 30psi and it seems to work well. I'm still playing with it. (the controller).
There are at least 20 point's of interest on these motors that need to be monitored during a high HP run, to calculate adjustments and to tune the accessories. Until we figure it out, I'll just take the position, that if a little is good, then a lot is better
Last time I took that position, it was expensive
The Snow kit may not work for everyones need's
I set the boost only switch to activate around 30psi and it seems to work well. I'm still playing with it. (the controller
). There are at least 20 point's of interest on these motors that need to be monitored during a high HP run, to calculate adjustments and to tune the accessories
. Until we figure it out, I'll just take the position, that if a little is good, then a lot is betterLast time I took that position, it was expensive
We are working on lowering the EGT's. On a DD this is more of a concern.
The Snow kit may not work for everyones need's
I set the boost only switch to activate around 30psi and it seems to work well. I'm still playing with it. (the controller
There are at least 20 point's of interest on these motors that need to be monitored during a high HP run, to calculate adjustments and to tune the accessories
Last time I took that position, it was expensive
Well If it get's to hot for ya, I have 2 spare engine's now one .20 over and the other with stock bores, it needs a little cleaning. I guess someone thought there Duramax was a submarine!!!!!!!